Today on the show Colin and Justin are joined by journalist Rachelle Schrute, who offers insights into the world of hunting.
The conversation explores the walls we build between outdoor categories and examines hunting in terms of conservation and ethical food sourcing, emphasizing how these principles can resonate with human powered outdoor enthusiasts.
Rachelle also shares her experiences taking curious individuals, including vegans, on hunting trips, illustrating the transformative power of firsthand exposure to the hunting process. This particular rock fight underscores the potential for greater unity within the outdoor community, encouraging listeners to consider the common ground that exists among diverse outdoor pursuits.
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Episode Transcript
Colin True
00:00:00.240 - 00:01:30.784
All right, everyone, before we get started today, I need to tell you about our amazing teammates at Darby Communications.
If you run an outdoor, an endurance or an active lifestyle brand, there is no better PR or digital marketing belay partner or drinking buddy than Darby. They can help your business reach new heights. And, you know, they might just keep you from falling on your ass.
I mean, since we started working with Darby, more and more people have been reaching out to us here at the Rock Flight because of that messaging. Look, guys, if they can help us, they can help anybody. Hit them up@darbycommunications.com do it today.
Welcome to the Rock Fight, where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows, and sometimes agree to disagree. This is an outdoor podcast that aims for the head.
I'm Colin True, and today we're knocking down silos between human powered outdoor activities and hunting and fishing with gear junkies Rachelle Schrute.
But before we get to that, come back on Monday for an in depth look at some of the topics that are dominating the conversation in the outdoor industry. Also on Monday, I'll be taking a look at how 2025 outdoor industry events are unfolding after some recent announcements.
Hey, have you checked out Open Container, the newest podcast available on the Rock Play Podcast Network? It's hosted by the legend Doug Schnitzbahn, Open Container. It goes deep into the topics that define the outdoor space.
Find it and follow it wherever you get your podcasts.
And while you're following Open Container, make sure you're also following this podcast, the Rock Fight, on whatever podcast app you are listening to us on. And also give both shows that five star rating. All right, let's start this show.
Chris DeMakes
00:01:30.872 - 00:01:34.940
Welcome to the Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight.
Colin True
00:01:36.040 - 00:03:49.378
Ever since the Bureau of Economic Analysis said in November of 2023 that the outdoor industry is worth over a trillion dollars to the economy of the United States, the thing that has stuck in my crawl is the realization of how divided our industry actually is. The outdoor stuff we talk about the most on the show.
Human powered outdoor activities is represented by the Outdoor Industry association, which sounds like a pretty big and broad thing until you realize that our portion of the trillion dollar economic pie is relatively small when compared to categories like RVs and boating. The reason this is important is that it feels like there are walls between the 90 plus categories that make up that BEA report.
Even though you would assume we have more in common than we don't. Because at the end of the day, the way we all choose to go outside may be different, but we all still Want to go outside and play. Right?
And this has been verified by past Rock Fight guests like Jessica Turner from the Outdoor Rec Roundtable has come on the show and mentioned that a lack of unity, or at least the ability to play nice, has been a real challenge.
For example, getting advocates of skiing and snowmobiling to see eye to eye, even though both of them rely on the same thing, which that would be snow, is apparently super challenging. So, yeah, finding ways to broaden connections and get past our baked in bias, that's a pretty big rock to throw. And today I'm targeting hunting.
I have a lot of friends who climb, ski, surf, run, hike, backpack, kayak, but I have zero friends who hunt.
And if you take a second and strip away the guns and ammo part of hunting, there is so much that is in line with all of those other activities that I just mentioned.
Things like backcountry exploration, the exhilaration of it all, wildlife encounters, and so there must be lessons that can be learned by the human powered activity world from the hunting side of things. Right? And that's why today's guest on the show is Rachelle Schrute.
Rochelle is a journalist for Gear Junkie, where she largely covers the hunt and fish beat.
She grew up hunting and fishing in Montana, where she still resides, and today she joins Justin Hausman and myself to offer us a deeper understanding of the hunting world. Welcome back to the Rock Fight, where today we're figuring out what the outdoor industry can learn from hunting with Rachelle Schrute.
Well, we're joined today by journalist Richelle Schrute, who is probably best known for her work writing about hunting and fishing for Gear Junkie. We've been trying to do this for a while. I can't believe it's finally happening. Welcome to the show, Richelle.
Rachelle Schrute
00:03:49.494 - 00:03:50.202
Thank you.
Justin Housman
00:03:50.306 - 00:03:54.970
And her Internet cuts out right there. And that's the show.
Colin True
00:03:55.090 - 00:03:55.866
That's the one.
Rachelle Schrute
00:03:55.938 - 00:03:56.138
Yeah.
Colin True
00:03:56.154 - 00:04:06.154
You're in the middle of Montana.
You just got reliable Internet, and you know that you get Dwight Schrute jokes that you just don't understand because you've never seen the Office because you live in the middle of Montana.
Rachelle Schrute
00:04:06.202 - 00:04:15.482
Or listen, I've seen the Office. There's a long backstory with that, which could be a podcast all on its own. But yeah, no, I do get the jokes often.
Colin True
00:04:15.666 - 00:04:21.866
I'm sure you do. That's a very specific name, and it's one of those like, thanks, thank you, people who made the Office. That's awesome now.
Rachelle Schrute
00:04:21.938 - 00:04:24.634
Appreciate that. Yeah, no, it's my fault.
Colin True
00:04:24.682 - 00:04:24.890
That.
Rachelle Schrute
00:04:24.930 - 00:04:26.310
Yeah, it's a long story.
Colin True
00:04:26.930 - 00:04:28.010
All right, well, next time.
Justin Housman
00:04:28.050 - 00:04:29.578
We'll do that next time.
Colin True
00:04:29.714 - 00:05:28.080
So Justin and I have been circling the topic of hunting for a while, with the big picture reason being that, I don't know, it feels like there's a divide that's very often present between those who pursue human powered outdoor activities and those who love to hunt and fish, who we both have a pretty pragmatic kind of view of the world as well, and understand, you know, that actually both of us would probably benefit from doing more of those activities. Justin fishes. I don't do either, frankly. And, you know, there's.
There's plenty of individuals who cross over between, like, motorsports or hunting or human powered sports. But then I also feel like there's a lot who make you feel like you have to pledge your allegiance sort of one way or the other.
I mean, and that happens even within those categories, right? It's like, well, you. If you're a climber, you're a climber. You can't be a skier too. Right?
It's kind of like the way some these things got to get presented sometimes. The reality is we all spend our time doing a lot of different things, but to start broadly, give us your kind of view of the outdoor world.
I mean, do you look at yourself? I'm a hunter. I'm a multi sport outdoor enthusiast.
Like, how do you relate to kind of my premise there of all these things and how they cross over with each other?
Rachelle Schrute
00:05:28.700 - 00:05:58.060
Man, that's a heavy question. I don't know that I identify as a hunter.
I feel like I've sort of been placed in that box because that's what I grew up doing, and it's what my family's always done, and it's become kind of trendy, and now my job sort of revolves around it. So it's like, I think it's just been a bubble I've been put in. I don't know what I would.
I don't know that I would identify myself with any specific outdoor activity. I do them all. I don't ski. Just wait, let's back up. I don't ski.
Colin True
00:05:58.140 - 00:06:00.204
You fit right in on this podcast. Perfect.
Justin Housman
00:06:00.332 - 00:06:01.276
Finally. Finally.
Rachelle Schrute
00:06:01.308 - 00:06:18.190
I think I do all of the rest of it. So I don't know. I don't really identify as a hunter or. I mean, I'm a terrible fisherman. I love it.
I'm a lucky hunter, but that's because we get hungry. But outside of that, I don't know what I would identify myself as.
Justin Housman
00:06:18.490 - 00:07:17.492
You know, I Just. I don't know why I've never thought about this before, but I wonder if. I suspect that that's more from.
From our side, from the, from the non hunting side that you know, that, that hunters like. I think a lot of us also like, like to fish. I mean fly fishing is pretty much an integrated part of the regular outdoor community, but hunting isn't.
I mean, obviously we use the term hook and bullet in the sort of, you know, journalist and marketing world to sort of define hunting, fishing as something else. And so I, I'm wondering how much that comes. That's probably comes from more from our side.
And I, and I'm thinking about how like hunting is such to someone like me who's never done it, such an extreme activity, you know, like. Like taking the life of an animal that I probably like is such a. Like, it's just.
I've never leapt over and so it feels like other than a fish, but it feels like something so separate from anything else that I would normally do or anyone that you know in my circle does that. I wonder. I think we put that we caused that divide. Colin. I don't think it's the hunting side.
Rachelle Schrute
00:07:17.676 - 00:08:23.260
I think it can come from both sides.
I think, you know, I had a conversation just the other day with, you know, talking about when you look at extremes, right, where you're in the center and you start moving to those peripheral edges of like ultra hunter and then your stereotypical like I'm gonna throw California under the bus, but your California vegan backpacker. They're on very opposite spectrums, right?
And I think both of them look at the other side as like the others or the others and they're not like us when in reality most of the.
I have a lot of friends and colleagues in both bubbles and instead my view has changed where it looks far less like this extreme sides and it's way more circular because it's like I have vegan environmentalist friends that are like pro water quality and very locavore. I want to eat local and have a low impact and whatever.
And then I have these like hardcore hunters that are super locavore and get their own food and are big on water and environmental quality. And so I feel like we both do. We both, both sides, I feel like, are like they're different than us.
And in reality I don't know that it's all that different. It's just like two sides of the same coin.
Colin True
00:08:23.600 - 00:08:39.746
It is. And it's a weird thing to even that we're Even in this position. Because I think about this a lot with like motor vehicles and stuff.
I mean, it was like 100 years ago that like people were still riding horses around, right? It was like a hundred years ago where if you didn't hunt well, you may not be eat eating. Right. I mean, and now.
Justin Housman
00:08:39.898 - 00:08:40.210
Right.
Colin True
00:08:40.250 - 00:09:36.582
And I think a little bit of that is the sort of.
And Justin, to your point, probably why it is more of the human powered side of the industry kind of driving some of the narratives that I'm describing because, you know, the boom of that category coming out of like the 60s, 70s and then definitely into the 80s and 90s and kind of that growing in extreme sports and it becomes this sort of popularized version of these activities versus just. We talked about in the pod the other day, Justin, about like, you know, you know, skiing was like transportation, right? That's what it was.
And all of a sudden it's like, well, listen, now we can also race against each other going downhill really, really fast. So I think there's probably a little bit of that kind of that. I think that's an astute observation that comes from our side.
I don't know though, like when. And also, Rochelle, you said you grew up in it, so it's kind of like you grew up hunting.
And I imagine there's probably the people who hunt who probably do the other human power activities, probably grew up in it. I can't imagine there's a lot of folks like our middle aged white guys or middle aged anybody who are like, hey, let's go start hunting. Now.
It's probably a, you know, more of a. It's part of your lifestyle from, from an early age.
Rachelle Schrute
00:09:36.686 - 00:09:37.782
Yeah, for sure.
Justin Housman
00:09:37.966 - 00:11:33.580
Yeah. I mean, I would, I. It's funny, I've. I've had opportunities to go hunting. Never, never.
Like with a great friend who's planned the whole thing out and let's go, you can join us. It's usually like, hey, if you want to go with me sometime, like, you know, I can take you out and like we can kind of see how this goes.
I, I feel like, well, I'm very prone to speaking for, for big swaths of people I've never met. But I feel like, you know, if you're in the outdoor space and you're not fascinated by hunting, like, I don't know, like, what's wrong with you?
I mean, I just like the, the idea of especially hunting. Okay. Now when I say hunting, I'm, I'm consuming almost entirely like meat eater content. Right.
Like, Steve ranella is like, the reason I even have ever thought about hunting. I've interviewed him a few times. Great dude. I love his books.
I got into his show when it first came out and I'm thinking like, wow, this is hunting, like, like backcountry traipsing for like three or four days, you know, off trail, like, like tracking animals. Like, who doesn't want to do that? I mean, that's an amazing, like, that's, it's.
It seems like the way that I talk about fly fishing a lot, which is that it's a connection with, with the environment in a way that like, just hiking or just camping will never be. Like, I'm, I'm physically immersed in the river and I'm in tune with the river in a way that I'm not. Even if I'm whitewater.
Maybe if you're whitewater rafting. But. But even still, it's a different level, right, where you're, you're, you're part of this ecosystem in a way that you're not otherwise.
And like, to me, that's the, like, such a huge appeal of hunting.
And if I, if there weren't so many barriers for me to do it now in terms of where I live, I live in a place I can hunt, I think within an hour or two, I could probably go hunting, I think. But, you know, there's like a million steps for me, you know, I have to.
I'd have to get a gun license, I have to get a gun, I have to learn how to shoot a gun, all these sorts of things. And it's like, I, Dude, I don't have time for that. I got two kids, you know, But I love the idea of like, I guess I could just go track animals.
I mean, I guess I could just do that. But I don't know, I.
It seems like I bet everybody who does, who plays the outdoors, even if they don't like the idea of killing an animal or eating meat, likes the idea of like, what hunting can be for sure.
Rachelle Schrute
00:11:33.620 - 00:11:37.660
I mean, I've taken, I've taken several vegans hunting now, which is.
Justin Housman
00:11:37.780 - 00:11:38.476
I've heard this.
Rachelle Schrute
00:11:38.548 - 00:12:00.676
Yeah, yeah. It's been kind of this thing that I enjoy doing. They either go really well or they don't. And I'm prepared for both of those scenarios.
But, like, I don't know that your experience with like, meat eater content is a great example of this, like, trekking into the woods and it's like three days and that's such a niche bubble.
Justin Housman
00:12:00.788 - 00:12:02.532
I'm sure it Is. Yeah, I'm sure it is.
Rachelle Schrute
00:12:02.636 - 00:12:10.532
The vast majority, I think of hunters are like parking their truck, walking 300 yards to their tree stand.
Justin Housman
00:12:10.636 - 00:12:11.044
Yeah.
Rachelle Schrute
00:12:11.092 - 00:12:13.812
Waiting for a deer. That's like, I would say that's the bulk.
Justin Housman
00:12:13.876 - 00:12:25.416
And that's the bulk fishing too. You know. And like I'm a backcountry fisherman, I like to hike way up and catch little trout and little free flowing streams.
But like I realize most people are dunking bait at the reservoir 10ft from their cooler, so.
Rachelle Schrute
00:12:25.488 - 00:13:48.548
Absolutely. Yeah. You can draw, throw a dry fly all day long in a mountain stream or you can throw a worm and catch fish all day long next to the parking lot.
Yeah, yeah. It's just you know, looking at like the, the perspective of, of out outdoors people and hunting.
I've tried to explain to people like there are days when I'm having a bad day and I can't. I've got writer's block or whatever. I have a tree stand that is in cell phone service.
I will take my laptop, I will hot spot off my laptop or off my phone, sit in that tree stand and there will be deer walking around underneath me and raccoons and like a beaver off the creek and whatever and I will sit there and work. You don't get the experience in the outdoors.
Even like hiking, you just don't get that like one on one experience until you're completely enthralled with like I know that this population of does is going to wander out of that Creek bed at 6:23 and I'm going to have 15 minutes to fill my B tag. Like I just, I know that, I know they bed here, I know they eat here. I know you know this is where they go to water.
This is when they, it's just you're so immersed. So. I mean I shoot way more animals with my camera or my phone than I have ever attempted to do with a gun or a rifle. I love that experience.
Experience of being like connected. So I feel like if you have the opportunity to go with someone, if you're hunt curious, don't go hunting. Go with someone hunting. Like it's rad.
Justin Housman
00:13:48.724 - 00:14:11.352
Yeah, I, I used to, I used to go, hopefully we'll do it again.
But my wife and I used to go to a dude ranch outside of Big sky every year right off the Gallatin river there, not far from the Yellowstone border and, and do these amazing like horse trips like up in the, you know, backcountry and which it sounds kind of lame but it's incredible. Like it's really, really fun.
Rachelle Schrute
00:14:11.456 - 00:14:14.380
And I feel like I used to work there. So I think I know exactly.
Justin Housman
00:14:14.800 - 00:15:28.382
It was called Covered Wagon Ranch. There's other ones around there. There's bigger ones too. But God, it was such a special thing that we used to do every year.
But the reason I bring it up is because they would shut that part down in like late August. And then they would convert to an elk hunting camp in September. And I forget what state. I can't remember what they're called anyway.
But was interesting is the last year we went, the owner of the place is like, you know, I think I'm gonna sell the hunting camp. He's like, I, I, I'm having more fun and more pleasurable experiences with photographers.
Like, they come out and they're, for whatever reason, they're probably, I don't, I don't remember how he explained it to me, but he said usually I'll get like a, like photographers that have really been doing this for a long time and they're very good at being in the backcountry and they're very good at, at just being quiet and just being present.
And I've had, he's had like, I've had so many bad experiences with people that like, bought some expensive rifle, they watched elk hunting on tv, they come out, they're terrified of bears, they're spraying each other with bear spray, they're taking bad shots at elk. And he's just like, it's just not like it's, I can't do it the way I want to anymore, so I'm just going to do photography instead.
And I thought, wow, that's, that's such an interesting thing. I would never have even have thought about the, that, that connection. Like, but it probably isn't that different, right?
Like, like taking a, taking a photo versus shooting an animal is probably not a whole different thing.
Rachelle Schrute
00:15:28.486 - 00:15:58.790
Yeah, very similar.
And you know, I, like, I, I've been involved in a lot of conservation organizations where I have struggled a lot with our like, R3, like this recruiting and all of this stuff where I'm just like, I don't think everyone should hunt because there's like a living creature on the other end of this. I want competent, informed, ethical hunters in the field. But I don't think everybody should hunt.
So, like, running a hunting camp sounds like a nightmare if you can like pur. Purchase a ticket and show up with a gun. Hard, Hard pass.
Justin Housman
00:15:59.330 - 00:16:00.510
That sounds terrible.
Colin True
00:16:01.490 - 00:16:48.024
I mean, this goes back to my comments. My original premise of more in common than people Realize potentially, right. Because this sound, these sounds like kind of outdoor problems.
I imagine if we had a mountain guide on here who's like, oh, yeah, you know, so and so showed up, whose buddy. Whose buddy is a. Is a. Climbs Rainier every year and told him this is the gear that, that you need to have.
And if we tell him that's not what he needs, he'll be like, well, my friend who climbs a lot says that this is what I'm supposed to have. Right? And then you kind of all of these problems and then even. Even just the getting into a new activity, right?
I mean, so it's so rare when you hear people, let's say, like, oh, I picked this up when I was like 46, right. It's usually at that point, you know, they've kind of look at that part of their life as in the past. So it's. It is a.
It's a daunting thing almost to pick up any activity in later in life. So that is. It's all sort of under the same bubble, isn't it?
Rachelle Schrute
00:16:48.152 - 00:16:57.288
For sure. Other than this involves, you know, bullets and pokies and things dying. So there's like. It feels like the stakes are so much higher.
Justin Housman
00:16:57.424 - 00:17:00.568
What's a pokey? A knife? An arrowhead? What are we calling pokies here?
Rachelle Schrute
00:17:00.624 - 00:17:02.264
Take your pick. Lots of pokies.
Colin True
00:17:02.392 - 00:17:04.680
Do you think it's sharp? That's amazing.
Rachelle Schrute
00:17:04.840 - 00:17:05.940
Sharp things.
Colin True
00:17:08.320 - 00:17:25.719
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00:17:27.019 - 00:19:25.170
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Colin True
00:19:27.630 - 00:19:56.956
And now back to the show. And I guess, I mean, look. And I understand that's gonna be a bridge for some people to get over. If people. If you. If you have a natural, you're.
You don't like guns. You don't like gun. The gun policy is rife with divisiveness. All of those things. At the same time, though, like, there is a. Like I put in our outline.
I am definitely hunting curious at this point mostly because I think I have enough knowledge to look at my own habits and kind of call bullshit on myself, right? It's like I definitely could say, you know what, man, if you're not willing to do it, you probably shouldn't just go buy, you know, the.
Justin Housman
00:19:57.028 - 00:19:57.308
The.
Colin True
00:19:57.364 - 00:20:16.932
The hamburger wrapped in plastic wrap at Ralph's, you know, this afternoon to go grill for the kids tonight, you know, and so that's where I kind of think they're. I would love to understand maybe your point of view of. What do you do with that? Like, should I. You said not everybody should go hunting.
You've taken vegans hunting. Is this something where it's like, if you're a little curious, it's worth. What. What do you do with that sort of curiosity?
Rachelle Schrute
00:20:17.116 - 00:20:20.580
You know, the last. The last vegan hunt that I went on. Yeah.
Colin True
00:20:20.580 - 00:20:22.644
I want to hear about vegan hunts. This is amazing to me.
Justin Housman
00:20:22.732 - 00:20:28.948
Well, they're not hunting vegans, Colin. Just make sure you understand. They're not hunting. It's not the ultimate game here where you're hunting.
Colin True
00:20:29.044 - 00:20:30.756
I thought they was gonna hunt. We're gonna hunt. Crossfitters.
Justin Housman
00:20:30.788 - 00:20:33.620
Yeah, I could tell. That's right. I could tell that's what you were thinking.
Rachelle Schrute
00:20:33.780 - 00:20:37.140
You're not gonna believe this, but that's not the first time I have heard that joke.
Colin True
00:20:37.220 - 00:20:37.840
What?
Justin Housman
00:20:40.620 - 00:20:41.600
I'm out.
Rachelle Schrute
00:20:41.980 - 00:20:42.836
I'm sorry.
Colin True
00:20:42.948 - 00:20:45.200
I was really proud of that in the moment. I gotta be.
Rachelle Schrute
00:20:46.580 - 00:21:18.488
Yeah, listen, this was one of those. The first one, I was a guide in the park in Yellowstone and I picked up a Family and I picked up their meals, and they were vegan meals.
So I was, like, already pre prepped for, you know, you, like, reconfigure how you're gonna talk about animals, whatever, in the park. And they got in the SUV and they were like, we googled you. And I was like, oh, no. Oh, no.
I'm stuck with you with no cell phone service in the park for the next. Okay, this is fine.
Colin True
00:21:18.584 - 00:21:20.616
This is how we're starting the adventure.
Rachelle Schrute
00:21:20.808 - 00:21:54.700
Yeah. And then it just turned into a million questions and fascination. And the guy hadn't eaten meat since he was 12. He had kids.
I think they were like 8 and 10 at the time. And his wife had converted to veganism. His kids had never eaten meat. So it was like this. We're just fascinated. It took a year and a half.
He came out, shot a dough. We processed it in the field. We ate his first meat in the field from the dough that he harvested. He cried, I cried.
He tries to come out and chew to dough every year. It's the only meat that they eat.
Colin True
00:21:54.860 - 00:21:55.404
Interesting.
Rachelle Schrute
00:21:55.452 - 00:22:33.796
And so, like, that's like this very beautiful. He, he wanted, he understood the value of it, and he was very much so, like a, a political and environmental vegan.
And he wanted his children to understand that we are not all so different, but if we're gonna do this thing, we need to do it our own way. Rad. And then, you know, like, the last one, Mary, she had this very black and white view, which is kind of awesome.
She is a lifelong vegan, and her opinion was, you are either vegan or you are a hunter, and everyone in between is the problem. And I was just like, whoa.
Colin True
00:22:33.828 - 00:22:36.742
That's kind of what I'm alluding to with, like, my own bad habits. Right?
Rachelle Schrute
00:22:36.916 - 00:22:48.610
Yeah. Like, wow. I've never actually looked at that.
I've never had someone on such an extreme end come to me with that perspective of, like, we are so different, but I think we're both on the right ends of, like, this big problem.
Justin Housman
00:22:48.730 - 00:22:49.538
Yeah.
Rachelle Schrute
00:22:49.714 - 00:24:13.880
And so what do you do with that? That's a really tough question. I mean, I, I, I tell. And even my kids, I tell them, you know, we should hunt, because we can.
And so now we are, in our own way, doing our small part. We are not part of the, the greater food complex or meat being trucked across, you know, state lines and international lines and all of this stuff.
We are making our impact to be as minimally invasive to an environment and a place that we love as we can. We're also Harvesting really, really healthy local meats that we know how they were. You know, they grew up in a natural environment. A natural.
That's air. That's. That's air quotes for people who can't see it. A natural environment. They lived an awesome life and then had one rough day.
You know, so then there's like this ethical thing of like, that seems better than a factory farm to me. So there's all of these things where it's like, we do it because we can.
I'm fully aware that there are a lot of people who shouldn't because they either don't have the capability or they're not willing to put in the time for this to get the skills or the financial boundary. Like, I can't imagine living somewhere where I have to get an out of state tag and buy a gun. Travel. And all of it's just overwhelming.
So that's one of those questions. I don't know. I don't know how you. Like you. I don't know there. I don't know that there is an answer other than those who can probably should.
Colin True
00:24:14.000 - 00:24:14.328
Right.
Rachelle Schrute
00:24:14.384 - 00:24:16.776
And those. I mean, who can't.
Colin True
00:24:16.968 - 00:24:33.372
I. I think you just described it, right. I mean, you talk about somebody who the. The family described, right? Like these. The kids have never eaten it.
He's like, the curiosity obviously became too much at some point where they're like, let's at least investigate this. And then to see. See what this is all about. And obviously it worked out really well for them.
Rachelle Schrute
00:24:33.476 - 00:24:43.452
Yeah, yeah, it's great. And that's. That's one of those great things. And of course, he also had the financial means. Right. He's going on a private guided trip into the park.
He's able to travel to Montana.
Justin Housman
00:24:43.516 - 00:24:46.680
Saves money on meat. Not eating any meat all year. He's saving all that money.
Rachelle Schrute
00:24:47.060 - 00:25:44.168
Yeah, yeah. You know, and then there's. There's this other kind of component of it where I've taken a lot of, like, moms, I don't do.
I don't tend to do women's hunts just because it. I don't know. Would you organize a men's hunt? No, it would just be a hunt camp. Right.
So I don't typically do women's hunts, but I've taken a lot of moms hunting, particularly single moms, just because in my area you can get on public assistance or for like $9, you can get a doe tag. So it's like, I thought about this such an empowering of like, is there anything more maternal?
Go out and feed Your kids, like you are literally going out and feeding it. So like there's those sorts of thing of like you can, so you should and can help you.
But then there's also the thing of like maybe you shouldn't and that's okay. And we have a, we have a food system that feeds humanity quite well in this country. And I don't know. I don't know. I don't. It's a.
Justin Housman
00:25:44.224 - 00:26:05.834
Well, I. Colin, I feel like you'd be better served going to a slaughterhouse than going hunting if your main concern is that afterwards.
Honestly, I don't, I mean I've never been. I know I would be in seconds. Although I don't think I'd ever give up pork. But I think I would be like within, within five hearing the sounds.
I wouldn't even need to see what was happening. That's it. I love, I love, I used to work on a cattle ranch. I love cows. But I mean on that topic, I.
Colin True
00:26:05.842 - 00:26:39.846
Think, I think it's, that's where the, there was a, there was the Food Inc.
Documentary which was sort of like a lot of that kind of stuff right where you watch it and you're like, oh God, I'm never gonna like touch meat again.
But then there was another one called Fresh and Fresh was basically kind of the same teachings of like organic farming and it was meat, fruit, vegetables and everything, but basically showing how small organic farms and the right correct amount can serve even large populous areas like, like, you know, a handful of organic farms in like LA could serve la, even though that's such a huge city. And so but the point is like the, you watch that and you, you left feeling inspired. I don't know how I would react to visiting a slaughterhouse.
Justin Housman
00:26:39.878 - 00:26:44.534
I don't think probably not inspiration. Well maybe to, maybe to never eat meat again, I suppose.
Colin True
00:26:44.582 - 00:26:46.930
But yeah, never to do anything again.
Rachelle Schrute
00:26:47.790 - 00:26:54.102
You know, you leave a film feeling inspired but then you know there's a Taco Bell drive thru on the way home.
Colin True
00:26:54.206 - 00:27:00.270
I thought it would be. I should have thought this out. I should have had like a McDonald's, like Quarter Pounder cheese. What do you guys think? You know?
Justin Housman
00:27:01.050 - 00:27:26.440
Well, hey Rochelle, I'm curious about the, the crying thing. Like I, I have no doubt that that's common amongst first time hunters.
And that's one of the things that I, I would say other than the, the just immersion in nature that I'm, that I'm interested in. I, I do.
There is a part of me that wants to know what it feels like to take the life of like a large mammal just, just because I assume it's a, it's a beautiful, sad.
Colin True
00:27:26.600 - 00:27:28.040
Because you've only taken the moment.
Justin Housman
00:27:28.120 - 00:27:38.264
I don't know, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
So I'm just wondering if that, if that's, if that's common amongst first time hunters and if you can possibly translate what that emotion, what they're feeling.
Rachelle Schrute
00:27:38.392 - 00:29:15.214
I don't know if I would say it's common.
I think a lot of the first time hunters that I've taken, there's such an adrenaline rush and you get the shakes and, you know when something's on the ground and then all of a sudden there's this like sense of accomplishment that I think people feel like, oh my gosh, I actually did it. Like, I did it. Holy cow, I did it. And so there's the shock thing.
I feel like most of the people that I know that cry during hunts are typically people who have hunted for, like me. There are, you know, I think that like endorphin dump and just like your heart is racing and it's.
I don't know, I don't see a lot of first time hunters crying. I get emotionally attached to animal. I get emotionally attached to them, you know, especially like elk hunting. Yeah, I cry. Of course I cry.
I've like, watched these animals through the year or through several years.
I, you know, I see them in the morning and I see where they bed and where they feed and I take a million photos and I, I know that this bull has a habit of rounding up cows and not letting them go far. You know, like there's all of these things and you watch them and they're beautiful. And then I choose the last sunrise.
You know, like, I have now taken that animal off the landscape. It's heavy. And if it's not heavy to like a lifelong hunter, not every hunt is heavy. Some of them are like, yeah, meat in the freezer.
Some of them are heavy.
And if they, when they stop getting heavy for me is when I'm gonna reconsider why I'm hunting and why I do it and my connection with these animals that it's so hard to explain. Loving something and then taking its life, it's such a weird emotional place to be.
Justin Housman
00:29:15.302 - 00:29:17.930
Yeah, I can't, I honestly can't imagine it, so.
Colin True
00:29:18.470 - 00:29:58.530
And tell me if I'm being like too. If I'm connecting dots, I shouldn't be connecting. Right.
Because I heard something recently about how humans have sort of lost the ability to understand death and just sort of like There used to be a time when death was just accepted, and now we've created a culture where we are prolong it at all costs. Right. No matter what.
And there's health professionals now who will talk to loved ones and say, this is what your person who is dying is going through and kind of trying to explain it. And because most people tend to put up sort of like, you know, a wall and be like, I don't want to know this.
I mean, is it kind of crazy to say that through the act of hunting, through what you just described, like, you are probably better prepared for those, those interactions in real life, not just be with animals, but with human beings as well?
Rachelle Schrute
00:29:58.650 - 00:31:44.064
100%. Yeah. It's one of those. Especially in today's day and age, we don't deal with death. Like a family member dies and they disappear.
And then if you see them again, they're made up and plastic and dolled up and in a box. There's no actual interaction with death.
And even like this year, my daughter is 19 and she's like, you know, I don't think I've ever actually ever field dressed an animal. Like, she's been on plenty of hunts. I just, I've always just, I do the work, whatever we get out. And I was like, you've, you're right.
You've never done that. And so we went sat. I knew the does would come out. I arrowed the doe, it dropped right in front of her and then it was on her.
She needed to field dress it. And there is something about seeing something alive and then the life is gone from that thing.
I don't think a lot of people see, they just don't see death. Even our family members, we tend not to see.
There's a, there's like this progress of, of death where, you know, it's warm, it's still, you know, it is still capable of being alive. It just isn't anymore.
And then slowly there's a line where goes from animal to meat, which I've tried to explain that to people where like once you're skinning, all of a sudden you're like, oh, this is just meat. Like, you look at it and it's meat. And taking my through that process of like field dressing an animal and it's, it's hard if you've never done it.
Like, it's just, it's messy and it's ugly and it's just, it's this, this thing that people just don't deal with. And so I think it's One of those. Those skills that definitely translates into, you know, it's just a part.
It's just a part of the thing and being so intimately connected with it. Yeah. If I have, you know. Yeah. The trauma of losing family members and things, I feel like I'm like, that's just part.
That's just part of a thing that I deal with every year. Like, I.
Colin True
00:31:44.152 - 00:31:44.640
Right.
Rachelle Schrute
00:31:44.760 - 00:31:55.340
It sounds so ridiculous, but like taking lives and being part of that death process I think would do a lot of people good. And even not taking them, but being at least part of it.
Justin Housman
00:31:55.800 - 00:33:00.358
It's interesting to hear you describe all this because all I can think about is how, like, we so clearly identify more with mammals than anything else.
Just because it's like everything you just described about field dressing an animal is not different than like gutting and cleaning a fish other than I have very. It's more like my attachment to that fish is on like a species level or something, you know, like. Like, obviously I don't know that individual fish.
I haven't been watching that fish. But I, I know where trout come at certain times of the year. I know what they're going to eat. I know what they're eating.
Like, you know, you're doing all that sort of stuff and I don't eat a lot of the fish I catch. It's pretty rare, but I will sometimes. And.
And you have that same moment where you're like, okay, it's alive, it's shiny, its eyes look a certain way, and then it's the eye. Once the eyes kind of go blank, that's it, it's dead. And now I'm cutting.
Now it's just a fish fillet, but it's not quite as heavy as you're describing because I'll just never have that connection with a fish. It's. It's maybe a huge fish, maybe a whale. I guess you might. But there is. I think there's something that, like mammal.
We're aware, like we're just closely connected, I guess. I don't know.
Rachelle Schrute
00:33:00.414 - 00:33:01.446
A whale is absolutely.
Justin Housman
00:33:01.478 - 00:33:08.668
A whale is a mammal. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I mean. That's like. Maybe that would be. That would be it. But like. Yeah, it's. It's interesting.
Rachelle Schrute
00:33:08.844 - 00:34:02.216
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, the, the odd thing is I.
I explained and I don't know why, and maybe it's a part of that, but like, the larger the animal, the harder it is for me emotionally as far as phys and physically. But like taking a big animal off the landscape. Yeah, it's just heavy. There's just something about it that is just emotionally burdensome.
And then by the time, you know, I've gotten it broken down and like into bags and whatever, then it's just like, this is so pure. This massive animal in the landscape is now coming home with me and it is going to fuel my family in a massive quantity.
Like, there's something so awesome about that. But initially, yeah, it's hard. It's like excitement, super sadness. And then I like get back to like this, this area of contentment.
And that sounds like a good day.
Justin Housman
00:34:02.288 - 00:34:14.040
That's a full day. I mean, that's a full emotional. Yeah. Or. Yeah. Right? For sure. For sure. Well, I want to go now. I want to go. I mean, at least watch, I think.
Rachelle Schrute
00:34:14.080 - 00:34:49.670
Yeah, I feel like a lot of people want to get into hunting and they're like, there's such a barrier of entry and there's all this gear and all this whatever. And I just, just, I want to tell people, don't go hunting. Go with someone who is hunting. Because then you get to see the experience.
And it's so important, especially on a successful hunt, to be part of it and see that animal die. And then what? The field dressing process is not for everyone. Like there are people that just cannot stomach it. Be part of that process.
And if that ain't for you, that's all right. We'll just keep doing it. And thanks for coming along and experiencing the ride. And it's funny.
Colin True
00:34:50.310 - 00:34:56.334
We'll bring my 19 year old daughter. Daughter along too and make her like go through and she'll be kicking and screaming, you know, but that's fine.
Justin Housman
00:34:56.382 - 00:34:56.782
Sounds great.
Colin True
00:34:56.806 - 00:35:03.470
She's outdoorsy, but she never once in her life says she wants to go hunting. Like, no, we're gonna, you're gonna experience this. We have to go. If I have to do it, you're coming with me.
Rachelle Schrute
00:35:03.590 - 00:35:08.286
Yeah, you can gag, you can puke, then you can cry and then we'll go home. It's gonna be fine.
Colin True
00:35:08.318 - 00:35:09.310
And we'll eat and it'll be great.
Rachelle Schrute
00:35:09.350 - 00:35:10.910
And then we'll. Yeah, it's gonna be amazing.
Justin Housman
00:35:10.990 - 00:35:45.524
I mean, who. I mean, like, that's the, that's the thing. At the end of the day, like, I live in a rural ish. Part of Northern California. Ish.
And there's deer everywhere. I'm sure there's deer in my backyard right now. And God, I love venison.
And I realize these deer probably wouldn't taste that good, but I'm just like, there's Too many deer here. We all know it. Like, they're everywhere. They're, like, walking through downtown, and I'm just like, nobody. I just have.
I have so many knives or, like, how hard could it be? You know, I'd be sure I would get my ass kicked. But. But, like, yeah, you know, it's. But like, I. And I just think, this is free here. It is. It's free.
Like, how much would it cost me to buy, like, a full side of venison somewhere? I don't know.
Rachelle Schrute
00:35:45.532 - 00:35:47.940
A lot, but, God, insanely expensive.
Colin True
00:35:48.020 - 00:35:48.788
Yeah.
Rachelle Schrute
00:35:48.964 - 00:35:54.532
And you know, the. I tell people the greatest meal you'll ever have is meat that was never cold. Like, it never got cold.
Justin Housman
00:35:54.596 - 00:35:57.044
That's such a cool thing to think. I've never thought about that.
Rachelle Schrute
00:35:57.132 - 00:36:23.302
Yeah. When you processed an An I. Not like, my typical hunts that are like my deer hunts right where I'm getting meat to feel the free, fill the freezer.
I just process it. I'm getting it home as. As quickly as possible. But like an elk hunt or, you know, something where we're back in a ways.
Either the tenderloins hit a fire, a hot rock or whatever. They just never get cold in that first meal. There's nothing. You can't describe it. It's a completely different texture. It's a.
Justin Housman
00:36:23.406 - 00:36:24.790
It's just absolutely.
Rachelle Schrute
00:36:24.870 - 00:36:31.398
Which is probably such a, like, caveman thing, because, you know, if before food was preserved, that's how it was.
Colin True
00:36:31.454 - 00:36:34.646
Yeah. This is. If you want to eat today, this is how you have to do it.
Justin Housman
00:36:34.798 - 00:37:07.274
The only time. The closest I've come to that at all is we raised a pig for my. For my wedding. We didn't raise it. We had friends that lived on a.
On a winery, and they had. They had pigs, and so they raised a huge hog for us, named her everything. And they. I mean, she was killed, like, two days before the wedding, like.
And, like, that's the closest I've come. And even that you're like, holy shit. This is different. Like, this is really, really, really different. I mean, for all I know, the organic meat I get.
The store's only been dead two days. I don't know. But it felt different to me because I. You know, it seemed like I just saw that pig two days ago. Like I said.
Yeah, I gave a little scratch, I.
Colin True
00:37:07.282 - 00:38:08.790
Guess when it comes back to the again. And I do feel like there is just.
There is just a natural divide for a lot of things we're talking about from the folks who just want to pursue, like, outdoorsy activities, like human Power kind of stuff.
If there is one advantage that the hunt and fish world kind of holds over that sort of human power world and is through the conservation point of view, right? The sale of gear licenses and whatnot.
You know, money goes in, it's, it's taxed and given in different ways to kind of preserve the natural world, all of those things.
And when you look at the outdoor industry, the vast majority, when we refer to the, you know, the outdoor industry is the human powered one because we have all the apparel brands, right. We have all the big billion dollar brands and who talk endlessly about sustainability and conservation and whatnot.
But you know, I think if you wanted to propose, hey, how about all of you, you know, you could do 1% for the planet. But like of all of you, all of the proceeds went to X. Cause there'd probably be a lot of pushback on that.
So I guess, is that a lesson you'd like to see big outdoor brands take from the, the hunt community? Is there anything else that you feel like the, the, the, the side of the outdoor world could learn from the hunt and fish community?
Rachelle Schrute
00:38:09.150 - 00:38:14.006
Man, that's a dream. Not like a, yeah, not a lot of lesson.
Colin True
00:38:14.038 - 00:38:15.222
It's like it's a pipe dream.
Rachelle Schrute
00:38:15.286 - 00:38:55.104
Yeah, you know, I, I look at it, you know, a great example, looking at like some of the anti hunting legislation that's come up, you know, and organizations that have pushed that where they're like, these animals are a public resource, they belong to all of us. And there's that cynical part of me that was like, you know, I think hunters, I think the Pittman Robertson act where we pay 11%, is it that high?
Guns, ammo, whatever. I think it raises like more than a billion dollars a year that pays for those animals. Like I, I agree they are a public resource.
Everyone should get to enjoy them. However, how about an 11% backpacker tax?
Colin True
00:38:55.192 - 00:38:56.780
Thank you. That's what I'm saying.
Rachelle Schrute
00:38:57.400 - 00:39:47.262
Sorry. Can you imagine the amount of money that would come from 11% on 10 and boots and sleeping bags and backpacks.
And I understand that nobody wants to really pay, especially in this economy, 11%, but the amount of good.
And then at that point those voices, wildlife management, whatever, and education and the reality of managing animals aside, those voices carry more weight when it's like it's a public resource. Sure.
Once the public starts paying for those animals to be out there and mean and paying for the, the organizations that keep them out there and, and you know, there's, there's a hard divide which I think there's like 14 million hunters in the United States, which sounds like a lot. It's not. It's like, it's probably way less than.
Justin Housman
00:39:47.286 - 00:39:49.230
There were like, 40 years ago, I'm sure.
Colin True
00:39:49.350 - 00:39:49.918
Easily.
Rachelle Schrute
00:39:50.014 - 00:40:16.688
Yeah. I mean, it's a very small percentage. And that very small percentage carries the bulk of the financial. Financial responsibility for.
For wildlife in general in this country. And then I look at. Okay, so the odds of that passing are slim to none. Whatever. There's going to be pushback.
But then as far as brands go, you know, those big brands can do so much more. There's a lot of talk, right? Everybody's like, plant a tree for every.
Colin True
00:40:16.824 - 00:40:21.312
50% of what we talk about in this podcast is like, big brands. Yeah.
Rachelle Schrute
00:40:21.456 - 00:41:45.506
And when I think of, like, hunt brands, a lot of hunt brands are also a lot of big talk, right? Like a portion of the proceeds. Yeah, a portion. But you'll never find out what portion and where it goes and how. How it's used.
Same with, like, conservate. There's a lot of conservation organizations where I'm like, where are you? What are you doing with this money? Like, I.
Other than throwing big parties to raise money to throw the next big party, I'm really confused on what's happening. And then you have like, like a great example. Kuyu, right? Hunt brand. Very specifically Hunt brand. They.
They fully fund a conservation program that literally.
And I've been conservation direct, we just went helicopter captured sheep from one area and moved them to another area so they weren't overpopulated and starving here and they could boom here. I mean, it was just paid entirely by the brand and its customers direct on the ground. Observable, recordable conservation efforts.
And there are not enough brands spend less money talking and marketing and maybe put a couple of boots on the ground to do real work in the real space or lobby there. Brands can get involved in politics and be like, hey, this is not okay and this is wrong and, and this is great and we should support this.
There's just too much timid, scared BS big talk that I would love to see some of the big, big brands.
Justin Housman
00:41:45.618 - 00:42:20.146
It is interesting how, like, Patagonia is known for this sort of like whether you, you know, whether you like them or not or whether you think they're in the right place or not. I mean, like, Patagonia is like, at least they. I mean, they, they. Well, I mean, I work for Patagonia on the side, so I'm a little biased.
But I mean, like, they do. They must spend a shitload of money on, on different conservation programs and, and reforcing programs and all these sorts of things.
And it's like, why are they the only brand that does that? I mean it's like every other brand in theory is like everybody.
The only reason people even give a about Patagonia is that is they associate them with environmental causes. Like why shouldn't that be the case with Mountain Hardware? It's. I've always thought that was weird.
Colin True
00:42:20.238 - 00:43:21.604
Well, I just think it's bad business sense if nothing else. Right. Because I'm sure there is a fair amount.
All these brands really, they market towards like one core aspect of their, of their customer base, which is what probably the brand was founded upon.
And I get that, but I can't imagine, you know, you go into any sort of again, outdoorsy arena, whether it's hunt, fish, motorsports, whatever, you're going to see a lot of the same brands. Yes. There are brands like Qu who are like, we cater towards hunter hunters and you know, that exist in all the categories.
But I'm sure if we show up at an overlanding event we'd see plenty of like, like North Face and Marmot and Patagonia jackets as well. So it's just, it's a, it's a broader.
I mean, I just think this is just a missed opportunity when we're talking when sustainability and conservation will never go away as core causes for the people, like people like ourselves who just want to go outside and enjoy these things in different ways. So why not sort of figure that out?
I mean, you know, and even you go back to the, the 11 you mentioned that it hits, you know, guns and ammo and things like that as attacks. You wouldn't even have to do 11% and it would be meaningful. Right. Sort of three.
You know, like all of a sudden we're talking a billion dollar brands here.
Justin Housman
00:43:21.692 - 00:43:22.532
Yeah, I've seen that.
Rachelle Schrute
00:43:22.556 - 00:43:24.996
Proposed a percent would be. Yeah, right.
Colin True
00:43:25.068 - 00:43:26.932
Half a percent. Great place to start.
Justin Housman
00:43:27.036 - 00:44:37.978
You know, one of the, one of the downsides about writing like every day is you forget stuff that you've written or you just kind of like the data comes in, the data goes out. Like I've written about the, the excise tax before and like why it started and I honestly don't even remember if it was difficult to get past.
If it was just about like we didn't. I. God, it's, it's like very vague in my mind.
It was like we didn't have quite enough money for, to pay for the conservation that we wanted to pay for. And like hunters and anglers were like the first people to step up and say like, well okay, like we'll shoulder some of that.
But it's like, I don't even know how you propose that now. Yeah, like the argument against backpack tax is always that like, you know, like I'm wearing this parka in my garage.
I'm not like out, you know, like I'm not on a, I'm not on public lands today. And that's generally the argument that people will make is that like, oh, it's not fair because you don't know what I'm using that backpack for.
I mean, I think that's. But you know, it is interesting to think about how at some point that was palatable politically to be like, especially.
I mean, what's crazy too is that like, you know, in my head, you know, hunters and anglers probably predominantly are, are, are more in at least in some ways on the conservative spectrum of the political spectrum. Right. Like, and are less likely to want to support federal anything really. But like excise taxes on stuff. Sure.
I mean, I don't know, maybe there's a big push back against it in the hunting community. I, I doubt it.
Colin True
00:44:38.114 - 00:44:50.886
But this is interesting just from the OR article was tells talks about like it is a. Basically it's a nonpartisan issue.
A lot of the biggest supporters of like the Explore act and things like that were, you know, the, the more right wing parts of Congress, you know, so it's.
Justin Housman
00:44:51.078 - 00:45:51.062
I still don't, like, I still don't understand how we haven't figured out how to make a bridge here. I mean like I think about this all the time when I'm in the eastern engineer for that every summer. Well, yeah, a sociological one.
I mean I'm in like I'm in the eastern Sierra. I'm in these like every, every summer I'm in, I'm in around the 4th of July. I end up being in Bridgeport, California.
There's a giant rodeo and it's like, it's nothing but like, like MAGA shirts and like all that sort of stuff the last few years.
And I'm just like, what's crazy is if we sat down and had a beer together in this bar, if we talked about anything but politics, we would have nothing but things in common. I'm in my four wheel drive truck, I got big tires on. I'm listening to country music. Like I'm drinking Coors, like I'm fishing.
Like it's just like it's the. And these things mean way More to me than politics ever would, you know? And it's like. And I know these dudes are the same way. Like, I.
I can talk to you about your. Your engine and like, like your lift kit. Like, I know all of that too, you know, and it's like, yeah, yeah. Did I vote for Biden? Yes.
But, like, who gives a shit? It's just wild to me that we cannot. Like that we just can't. I don't. Oh, God. Drives me now.
Colin True
00:45:51.086 - 00:45:59.174
Politics just become sports. That's just what it is. It's like, I have a Yankees jersey on. You have a Red Sox jersey on. And we can't. Like, we.
We're not allowed to like each other anymore. Right.
Rachelle Schrute
00:45:59.262 - 00:46:09.670
You know, my involvement for. In politics now is like, I read the news and then I open my front door and I scream into the void. And then I shut my door and I sit back down.
Justin Housman
00:46:09.710 - 00:46:11.178
That's a solid strateg.
Colin True
00:46:11.294 - 00:46:12.530
That's a really. It's actually.
Rachelle Schrute
00:46:12.650 - 00:46:17.618
It's the best cortisol dump you can. It does nothing, but it does.
Justin Housman
00:46:17.674 - 00:46:18.322
You too can do that.
Colin True
00:46:18.346 - 00:46:21.554
If you move to the middle of Montana and do podcasts using starlink, you.
Rachelle Schrute
00:46:21.562 - 00:46:22.354
Can do it from wherever.
Justin Housman
00:46:22.402 - 00:46:26.626
Yeah. No one's gonna. It's not illegal to scream yet. It will be soon. But now you're allowed.
Colin True
00:46:26.658 - 00:46:31.042
You don't know my neighbor across the street. The police would be here in minutes. I think you're like, I feel like.
Rachelle Schrute
00:46:31.066 - 00:46:33.682
If you explained your reasoning, they'd be like, that's a good point.
Justin Housman
00:46:33.706 - 00:46:34.290
You know what? There's a.
Colin True
00:46:34.330 - 00:46:34.866
There's a guy.
Justin Housman
00:46:34.898 - 00:46:43.532
Yeah, There's a guy that lives across the street from me, this huge guy, and he has Tourette's. And so every once in a while you'll hear like, motherfucker. And like, maybe he. Honestly, maybe he doesn't have Tourette' threats.
Rachelle Schrute
00:46:43.596 - 00:46:45.612
He's just reading the newspaper.
Colin True
00:46:45.756 - 00:46:49.980
He's using the Rochelle strategy for politics. He heard about it on the rock fight.
Justin Housman
00:46:50.020 - 00:46:50.828
I'm gonna join him.
Rachelle Schrute
00:46:50.884 - 00:47:06.732
Yeah, no, I was just gonna say, you know, back to like the. How do you propose the backpacking tax? Politically, the. The argument that I get from people where I'm like, we pay for it all. Would you like to.
But we're non consumptive. It's non consumptive. You hike. I'm not taking anything from you.
Colin True
00:47:06.756 - 00:47:09.916
No, no. I think I can prove some consumption how that back was made. I don't.
Justin Housman
00:47:09.988 - 00:47:13.826
That seems like a silly argument, but seems to stick.
Rachelle Schrute
00:47:13.938 - 00:47:15.202
Non consumptive.
Colin True
00:47:15.346 - 00:47:20.098
Right? So it's because you take an animal off the land, you should have to pay extra for that.
Rachelle Schrute
00:47:20.234 - 00:47:21.538
That's the argument that I get.
Justin Housman
00:47:21.594 - 00:48:10.522
I think, I think they're, you know, one of the. One of the things that I do wonder about is like, okay, especially in the current political climate, if.
If there is some sort of like, massive pullback on federal funding for a lot of things that we enjoy doing, like, maybe at that point the backpack tax makes sense. It's like, okay, the federal government's not paying for this anymore.
Sort of like, I don't know, public radio or something like that where it's like, you know, there's dwindling amounts of funds coming from the federal government. So if you like this station, you need to pay for it.
And so maybe, maybe it'll just be something like that where, like, I mean, obviously, like the Explore Act. I just wrote an article about part of it this morning and it's like, we. It's hard to know if any of that's going to get gutted or not.
We don't know shouldn't. But who knows now? But it's like, okay, so now, now we need to step up.
Like, now it's time to step up to protect the organizations that are fighting for what you fight for. And if it means an extra dollar every time you buy a backpack pack, every five years that you buy one.
Colin True
00:48:10.706 - 00:48:15.946
Pay the brands, it should be like if, if any of us in charge of those brands, like, yep, okay, we're on board with that.
Rachelle Schrute
00:48:16.018 - 00:48:16.266
Yeah.
Colin True
00:48:16.298 - 00:48:29.770
But, yeah, well, listen, I think we can wrap it up there, guys. Relle, thank you so much for coming on.
Sorry it took so long and we really are excited to have you on again in the future because this is obviously a topic that we're fascinated with and want to continue to pursue. So thank you so much for joining us.
Rachelle Schrute
00:48:29.890 - 00:48:30.842
Yeah, this is a blast.
Justin Housman
00:48:30.906 - 00:48:31.946
Yeah, that was fun.
Colin True
00:48:32.098 - 00:48:52.592
All right, that's the show for today. Big thanks to our guest, Rachelle Schrute. You can find her work by heading to gearjunkie.com the Rock Bite is a production of Rock Fight LLC.
For Justin Houseman, I'm Colin True and back to take us out. It's a guy who hunts for badass guitar licks. It's Kristen Makes. And he found one with the Rock Fight fight song. We'll see you next time.
Rock fighters.
Chris DeMakes
00:48:52.656 - 00:49:48.560
Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight.
Rock fighting to the rock fight where we speak our truth Slay sacred cows and sometimes agree to disagree.
We talk about human powered outdoor activities and big bites about topics that we find interesting like pop culture music, the latest movie reviews, Ideas that aim for the head. This is where we speak our truth. This is where we speak our truth.
Rock flight, Rock flight Welcome to the rock flight Rock flight, Rock flight welcome to the rock flight Rock flight, Rock fight Rock flight, Rock flight, rock fight welcome to the rock fight Rock fight Rock fight.
Justin Housman
00:49:50.700 - 00:49:51.340
Rock fight.