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The State Of The Outdoor Economy Plus: Stio Launches Footwear

Today on the show Colin is joined by Producer Dave and Outdoor Industry Insider Eoin Comerford to take a look a bigger look at the outdoor industry.


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Optimism was high at the end of 2024 that the outdoor industry was due for a come back year. Inventory issues had improved and open to buy was increasing. But with the end of the first quarter just a couple of weeks away things have fallen off of a cliff. We take a look at what happened and what to expect. (07:25)


Then the crew turns their attention to a new backpack by Yeti (that looks an awful lot like something made by Mystery Ranch) and the recent news that two outdoor parent companies, Solo Brands & Pelican International, are experiencing financial distress. Is this related to the other issues the industry is experiencing? We take a deeper look. (24:59)


Lasting for The Parting Shot Colin looks at the new footwear collection launched by Stio. Will Stio's Mahomes like luck continue? (43:08)


Check out hundreds of wildly cool products by visiting and shopping at Garage Grown Gear!


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Episode Transcript

Colin

00:00:00.400 - 00:02:29.716

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If your retail game is feeling like it's stuck in easy mode, Endeavor is the upgrade you need to unlock next level sales, max out your team's knowledge and beat the boss when it comes to customer experience. Head to Endeavor. That's End VR IO to learn more today.


Welcome to the Rock Fight, where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows, and sometimes agree to disagree. This is an outdoor podcast that aims for the head. I'm colin True. It's St.


Patrick's Day, so get your Guinness and your shamrocks ready because joining producer Dave and myself is a legit Irishman, Owen Comerford, and we're going to talk about the state of the outdoor economy. But before we get to that, come back to the Rock Fight this Wednesday, when outdoor journalist Justin Hausman will be off this week.


So I'll be joined by outdoor journalist Shantae Salibair to talk through recent headlines that come out of the outdoor community and and then also come back on Friday, where I'll probably be rolling solo with a hot take.


Lastly, it's time for you to subscribe to this show and also to Open Container, the newest Rock Fight podcast that is hosted by outdoor industry legend Doug Schnitzman. All you have to do is tap the follow button on whatever Podcast app you are listening to us on and also subscribe to News from the front.


Rock Fight's weekly newsletter that comes out tomorrow. So head to Rockfight Co and sign up now and stick around. We'll be right back.


Chris DeMakes

00:02:29.788 - 00:02:33.840

Welcome to the Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight.


Colin

00:02:35.900 - 00:02:51.800

You're listening to Rock Fight Radio. No fit Socks is riding high with a string of number ones.


And because of that success, they were able to get super producer Rick Albini to remaster this hit. We Believe in the sock. Here we go. It's time for Fitz.


FITS!

00:02:52.700 - 00:04:12.940

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We believe in free range toes and having room to roam and fine gauge merino wool as comfortable as home. We believe in Made in USA and we believe in doing what we say Wear fits. We fit that's right, that's right Wear fits.


We fit that's right, that's right and then believe in the sock Fits, fits, fits we believe in the sock Fits, fits, fits we believe in the sock we believe in the sock Fits, fits, fits, fits we believe in the sock fits.


Colin

00:04:15.280 - 00:04:28.776

And now back to the show. All right, we're here on St. Patrick's Day with Owen Comerford, who's actually Irish, and producer Dave, who's actually a mix of.


You changed the outline. That's not fair. You're not allowed to change the outline. Norwegian and Oregonian.


Producer Dave

00:04:28.808 - 00:04:35.750

I'm sorry. To be factually correct. Then you're just made up shit that you just put. Yeah, right. But just made up.


Colin

00:04:37.330 - 00:04:38.570

What's up, guys?


Producer Dave

00:04:38.730 - 00:04:40.506

Nothing. Nothing is up.


Eoin Comerford

00:04:40.578 - 00:04:43.674

I'm wearing green. Are you? Are you wearing green? I think.


Colin

00:04:43.842 - 00:04:45.670

Well, it's technically Friday now.


Eoin Comerford

00:04:47.410 - 00:04:48.330

Exactly.


Colin

00:04:48.490 - 00:04:54.490

How do we greet an Irishman from Ireland on St Patrick's Day? Is there a way to do it? Are we supposed to, you know, Is there a method?


Eoin Comerford

00:04:54.570 - 00:04:56.864

You raise a Guinness and you say slauncha.


Producer Dave

00:04:56.962 - 00:04:58.356

Slaunch. Fantastic.


Colin

00:04:58.388 - 00:05:03.236

All right, there we go. We should all gotten Guinness for this at, you know, 11:00 in the morning on four days before.


Producer Dave

00:05:03.388 - 00:05:09.572

I'm super down with that. And I want you to know I'm wearing the American Irish version of army green. So there we go.


Eoin Comerford

00:05:09.756 - 00:05:11.316

Okay. All right.


Colin

00:05:11.468 - 00:05:21.080

Hey, before we get into it, I had to take one opportunity, Dave. The ultimate brand asshole opportunity came out this week. Did you see the hats that Major League Baseball released?


Producer Dave

00:05:21.740 - 00:05:23.812

Yes, I did. Yes, I did.


Colin

00:05:23.836 - 00:05:24.696

Did you see it, Owen?


Eoin Comerford

00:05:24.788 - 00:05:25.860

Yeah. Yeah.


Colin

00:05:26.680 - 00:05:27.488

Amazing.


Producer Dave

00:05:27.584 - 00:05:28.080

Yeah.


Colin

00:05:28.160 - 00:05:48.700

I mean, like I talk about Owen for the listener. Maybe didn't missed it.


Major League Baseball released hats that basically had the team names written across the front of the hat within the logo imprinted right in the middle across that team name, which then resulted in a lot of inappropriate words. So Google it if you want to see what we're talking about.


Eoin Comerford

00:05:49.240 - 00:05:59.110

Yeah, I think the one that, the one that, the one that broke the Internet was, it was Texas, but the X was replaced by the T as the, as the logo.


Colin

00:05:59.190 - 00:06:05.510

So yeah, so yeah, titas. And then you had the other good one was the Angels, which then became anals.


Producer Dave

00:06:05.670 - 00:06:10.810

Yes, yes. And the Astros become assholes. Yeah, assholes.


Eoin Comerford

00:06:11.550 - 00:06:35.500

So I think the funny part is this is actually really talks about the need for more inclusivity in our industry because if you actually had Spanish speaking people that worked for whoever the hell it was, fanatics or new era or something. New era, maybe I think, okay, maybe they would have figured out that, oh shit, we're just like cursing all over the place right now.


Colin

00:06:35.800 - 00:06:46.224

They had anals and they missed it. This is what I mean. The ultimate brand asshole opportunity.


Someone had knocked down, I would have taken what, half a second, walked in like, yeah, you can't do this. You can't do this.


Eoin Comerford

00:06:46.312 - 00:06:56.812

The funniest part is that they've taken them all down. But these things are like selling on ebay for a grand a pop. I mean, everybody wants, it wants a Tate ass hat right now.


Colin

00:06:56.996 - 00:07:09.320

You know, the funny thing is you don't even need to have the dirty ones. Like if you look at the Boston one because it's the B, it looks like Bobin. I mean, it's just like, it's just the dumbest thing.


How do you not see that you're creating words by what you're doing?


Producer Dave

00:07:11.860 - 00:07:24.206

It's amazing that the front page story on USA Today is baseball caps yanked from shelf because they're risque. That's just fantastic. Oh my gosh.


Eoin Comerford

00:07:24.398 - 00:07:25.182

So good.


Colin

00:07:25.286 - 00:08:27.032

All right, well, let's get into what we're going to talk about today, which the opening shot today is presented by Garage Growing Gear, your hub for ultralight gear. Learn more by heading to garagegrowinggear.com and we're going to talk a little bit about the state of the outdoor economy today.


Because heading into 2025, the general consensus was that this year would be somewhat of a return to form of sorts for the outdoor industry. The prevalent inventory issues being resolved, open to buy on the rise, participation hitting all time highs.


Many, including our own own Cumberford Felt, you know, optimistic, you know, back at the end of 2024, that by the time we got to the end of this year, we would have, you know, maybe come back a little bit. But something funny happened on the way to the gear shop.


In January, we got a new presidential administration who seems to be hell bent on sewing chaos everywhere. And apparently things look a little different than we expected them to be as we sit here in the middle of March.


So, Owen, why don't you take us through this. You and I were chatting a little bit yesterday about this.


You know, let's start with where things were at the end of 2024 and the optimism we, the optimism we felt just a few months ago and kind of where we've ended up now a few months into this new year.


Eoin Comerford

00:08:27.136 - 00:10:20.464

I mean, really, the beginning of 2024 was, was still pretty rough. I mean, you look at everything that happened, you know, the REI results and how they were feeling.


You look at, you know, EMS and the bankruptcies in Basque and all the things, right, so. And it felt like just we had really been through it as an industry since 2023, really mid-2022, so two years of really, really rough stuff.


But it felt like the pall was lifting in the second half of 2024 as I think finally we were through the worst of the inventory glut, I would say. You know, brands weren't being quite as incredibly discounting on their own websites.


Retailers were kind of pulling back a little bit for a lot of the publicly traded companies that you were starting to see a combination of a return to comp growth with margin expansion, which really talked to a reduction in discounting. And actually, if you look at some of the publicly traded stocks, like I was looking today at VF Corp.


At Columbia, Wolverine Worldwide and Dick's Sporting Goods, if you look at those, on average, between July 1 and the end of January, they were up like 21%. And a lot of them, it was just like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, like a steady rise.


And really, really, I think the overall mood was, okay, we're through the worst of this. 2025 isn't going to be like a banner year.


I don't think anybody was saying that necessarily, but they felt like, okay, I think we may have some stability here. We've kind of found bottom and we're going to kind of get the inflection going back up again.


And since, since the end of January, I don't what happened at the end of January, I don't know. But since the end of January solicit.


Colin

00:10:20.512 - 00:10:21.072

Little thing.


Eoin Comerford

00:10:21.176 - 00:10:38.178

Little thing. You look at the stock price and it has fallen off a cliff.


We're actually, if you take that, those, that's those same four basket of stocks, we're down 19%. So seven months, we grew 21%. Boom, boom, boom. Six weeks we're down.


Colin

00:10:38.234 - 00:10:39.170

Giving it all back.


Eoin Comerford

00:10:39.290 - 00:10:57.554

Giving it all back. And, and, and, and it's, and it's like, it's like a, it's like a cliff. Right.


And you, you listen to, you know, you know, what, what I hear privately from folks and also just public statements from companies, and everyone's like, spooked. It's like, whoa, what is going on here?


Colin

00:10:57.642 - 00:11:04.398

Yeah. Every category isn't just like one category is like, oh, they're struggling over there. Right. It's like it's seemingly everything is impacted.


Eoin Comerford

00:11:04.594 - 00:11:18.886

Yeah. I mean, if you look at Citi just came out with some of their results that said quarter to date for apparel. Quarter to date.


And that's, you know, the retail quarter. So the beginning of January 1st.


Colin

00:11:19.038 - 00:11:19.734

Yeah.


Eoin Comerford

00:11:19.862 - 00:12:25.070

Apparel is down 12%. Athletic footwear. Okay. Down 22%. That's. Wow, those are huge numbers. And so really, really struggling.


And then you have folks like Walmart who obviously are more at the, you, the lower income side of things.


They're talking about the fact that people are buying smaller pack sizes of things at the end of the month because they can't afford to get the regular pack size because they're running out of money before they get paid. Airline bookings, way off.


People are just saying, well, I don't know, I'm going to hold off on that trip to Europe or whatever and wait and see what happens here.


And then even luxury, which over all of this luxury has kind of been untouchable in terms of its sales because we've got this whole income in quality thing going on. Even luxury spending. Luxury spending was down 9.3% in February.


And, you know, that's actually probably the scariest one from an outdoor perspective because let's face it, a lot of our consumers are actually in the 100,000 plus and up range. Right.


Colin

00:12:25.110 - 00:12:27.390

Those are a lot. The luxury purchases. Right. Exactly.


Eoin Comerford

00:12:27.470 - 00:12:30.734

They're the ones buying the $500 shells. Exactly. Right.


Colin

00:12:30.822 - 00:12:31.326

Yeah.


Eoin Comerford

00:12:31.438 - 00:12:33.730

So, yeah, it is rough.


Colin

00:12:34.430 - 00:12:44.530

So what's driving it? What are the things you think that are really. I mean, obviously it's a lot of things. Right.


Because it's crossing so many categories, but specifically, kind of drilling down on it. What do you think is really driving this?


Eoin Comerford

00:12:44.910 - 00:14:35.484

Well, some of this had been kind of building up for a while. Like, for example, all of that stimulus money has been slowly ebbing and ebbing and ebbing.


And if you look at savings levels for people and credit card debt, we're basically kind of back to where we were pre pandemic, roughly. Okay, so people got all that money, they kind of saved it or they paid off their credit cards. That's all gone. Right? So that's gone out of the market.


There's a lot more job uncertainty now because of everything that's going on with federal employees, obviously, but just an overall feeling of, is anybody safe in their current role? People are switching jobs less. People are seeing less. Less wage increases going on.


So everyone's feeling a little bit scared there in terms of their roles. Like, is I going to take my job? You know, what's going on? Right. So there's that piece you've got. Housing costs remain very high.


People have been hoping, oh, this is the year that mortgage rates come down, because the Fed's going to act there. The Fed's not going to act because they're worried that tariffs are going to blow things up. Right. So housing costs are super high.


But the really big one, though, is just the overall level, the tariff uncertainty thing. Right. It's on again, it's off again. And so people are like, what is going on? And so this is. And this is affecting business as well.


And so business is feeling really just whipsawed around because of the whole tariff thing. That affects the way business leadership acts.


That affects the way people feel about where they work, and that also affects people's feeling about, you know, am I. Am I going to be able to afford stuff if. Yeah, everything goes up 25%.


So it's just creating this really weird moment where people just feel like, what the f is going on right now, Dave?


Colin

00:14:35.612 - 00:14:53.186

This isn't. It doesn't get talked about a lot with us, but, you know, if you're sitting at a brand, like how you.


How messaging goes, and messaging is always a topic, but like, when you sit here in this kind, how do you present your brand?


How do you kind of go out in the public and, like, you know, either inspire people to support you or kind of like, what message do you even send from a brand at this, at a time like this?


Producer Dave

00:14:53.338 - 00:15:55.722

Yeah, that's a good. That's a good question. I think obviously you kind of where your brand is on its life cycle is certainly important to this.


I think that the bigger brands have a different playbook. If you're at a smaller brand you're kind of always living in a challenger mindset. And so you're kind of always having to do more with less.


You're trying to carve out niche opportunities within this larger kind of group.


And so I think those are the types of strategies that probably play well for times of economic downturn, but like I said, they kind of already play into your challenger mindset. The outdoor is not a monolith. Right. From a psychographic perspective as well as an activity perspective.


So this idea that there's going to be an downturn for all of these macro reasons, there's still bits of positivity that you've got to go find and places and really more important to find people who are your types of folks, your types of enthusiasts, your types of.


Colin

00:15:55.746 - 00:15:57.770

Life, how you endear yourself to folks. Right.


Producer Dave

00:15:57.810 - 00:16:21.196

It's kind of, this is good advice anytime, but right now it becomes very crucial because those dollars are important and those, those committed customers are fewer. So you've really got it. You can't waste your time with too much waste in your messaging or your communication budget.


You've really got to really hone who you're talking to and make sure that they are on the, on the likely list.


Eoin Comerford

00:16:21.348 - 00:17:38.776

Typically when things are rough and the consumer is feeling spooked, that's usually the best time to actually give them a little bit of escapism. Yeah, right.


And to talk about the restorative nature, being outdoors, really inspire them with really aspirational type things, really get people excited about the outdoors. Give them something else to think about than the economy or the administration or whatever. So that's one element of advice I think, which is good.


But then if that's all you do and you're not speaking out against some of the things that are impacting the outdoors and our access to public lands and to the employees that work those public lands, then is that short sighted? It's a tough balance.


And what I'm seeing right now is, and I've looked across the social media of most of the leading brands just to see what the mood is out there right now. And it is like all steam ahead. It's products, it's vistas. I mean, nobody's talking about anything related to, outside of maybe REI and Patagonia.


No one's talking about anything about what's going on in like the serious stuff. No one's talking about that. It's all, oh, here's our latest, you know, Gore Tex, ba ba da ba. It's just, yeah, how much is that?


Producer Dave

00:17:38.848 - 00:18:05.356

The scope of I was gonna say, how much is that. The fact that a lot of these. A lot of these campaigns and communication, you know, were set in motion a couple months ago.


And so they're just not even reacting or set up to react to these changes that are only four weeks old, five weeks old, if you will. So there's that just kind of the inertia of the system, but then there's also just. I think you're kind of getting at the reluctance to.


To even take some of this stuff on. And.


Colin

00:18:05.428 - 00:18:52.284

Well, the scope is so much bigger this time. Right. I mean, a lot of. A lot of you think back to Trump 1.0, and it was like, oh, bears ears.


And we had something we could really latch onto and everything. And now it's just like, to Owen, to your point, like, we're just crossing so many different. Where do you want to put your attention?


You know, is it public lands? Is it just, you know, sales? Is it. Where do you want to. How do you kind of. Where do you want to speak out?


I mean, a friend of the pod, Wes Allen, you know, the retailer out of Wyoming, he wrote a piece on LinkedIn this week, kind of talking about this from his perspective and kind of offering his point of view. And he's kind of seeing a lot of the same things coming from the retail point, point of view. I mean, who does. Who's at the most risk right now?


Is it, you know, the brands, retailers, consumers, all the above? I mean, because this is.


I hate to use the word unprecedented because it sounds like a hyperbolic, like, podcast thing to say, but this kind of unprecedented in a lot of ways.


Producer Dave

00:18:52.332 - 00:19:00.160

Actually, unprecedented doesn't mean what it used to mean anymore, Colin, because now everything is unprecedented. Yeah, it's not hyperbolic at all. It's actually understating.


Eoin Comerford

00:19:02.340 - 00:19:17.694

I would say that word back. I mean, it's definitely one of the great points, actually, that.


That west brings up in his piece is the potential impact on international travel and people coming in to the US to visit our national parks and just to recreate in general. Right.


Colin

00:19:17.782 - 00:19:23.502

We're already seeing it. There was an article this morning about how Canadians aren't coming to our Western US Ski resorts this winter. Right.


Eoin Comerford

00:19:23.526 - 00:20:59.542

But it's not only that, because I think we're a little bit blind to the degree to which the rest of the world actually does pay attention to what's going on over here.


I would say, quite frankly, there's a lot of people that I know in Europe that are better informed of what's actually happening than Quite a few Americans, which is kind of scary at least.


But, but what I would say is the rest of the world is really shook by what they're seeing right now in the US and some of the headlines over there are about, about people like, like I just reading today about two German tourists who ended up being detained for two to six weeks in a detention center near, near where you live, Colin. And so it's because they were trying to cross the border from, from Tijuana. Both had their, you know, documents or whatever, whatever.


You know, there was maybe some, some irregularity, but you get thrown in a detention center without any access to a lawyer or anything. And, and this is creating real trepidation for Europeans who are, who are potentially who were thinking of traveling and coming over here.


So yeah, I think we're going to see a big impact there in terms of just, of those folks coming in to, to visit and then, you know, and if you're flying in from Europe, you know, you may want to, you may not want to, you know, lug all your stuff with you.


So yeah, maybe you are going to hit the gear, the gear store on the way to Yosemite or whatever and you know, pick up your, your, your meals, your, your, your fuel, your whatever else, whatever. Right? Yeah, it's not good.


Colin

00:20:59.646 - 00:21:06.130

Well, so what are our predictions? Like what are your predictions for the rest of the year? How does this play out? Is there any way to even tell how this plays out?


I mean, there's just so much uncertainty right now.


Eoin Comerford

00:21:07.110 - 00:22:42.690

Yeah, there isn't.


And the challenge for some of these public companies, like Dix as an example, they had a record fourth quarter, I mean just off the charts good sales up 6%, margins were up. It was just great. But then all they did was say that their guidance for the year was a little soft.


So they still said they were going to grow 1 to 3%. But the margin guidance or the profit guidance was a little soft. They got absolutely killed. Their stock, stocks down like I don't know, 18%.


And that's actually, they're being, I wouldn't say they're being alarmist in what theirs is. And I think it's tough for some of these companies because they're worried. They have a huge amount of uncertainty as well.


But they also don't want it to become a self fulfilling prediction if a bunch of companies come out and say, well, we think it's a shit show, our sales are going to be down 5 to 10% this year. Well, suddenly the stock market just starts to crash. Everybody feels like the world is ending. And it really does become.


We go from a little lack of consumer confidence straight into a recession. So it's tough right now, but then you've got the administration that is basically saying, hey, maybe we need a recession. Maybe we need that.


Because what's really important is we get these tariffs in place. That's what's important. It's kind of nuts.


Colin

00:22:43.590 - 00:22:47.770

All right, Dave, pull us out of the muck here. Say something. What do you got for us?


Producer Dave

00:22:48.790 - 00:23:49.320

Where's it going? Well, I mean, look, let's think the repair and rental market should be doing well. We're going to start to see doubling down. Maybe that's not so bad.


As much as we're hearing the doom of our public lands and the layoffs at parks, I think some of that's gonna be clawed back. But I do believe the entry level and accessible will still be a focus of people because that's the options we're gonna have.


And so even though we're talking about that doom and gloom of that, I do think that that's still gonna continue to rise and new people getting into the outdoor or just again, that entry level, the pinnacle is always going to be there. They're going to find their money.


The dirtbags are going to find their way to the places they need to go to and do the great things that kind of keep that engine of the outdoor going. So, yeah, I just, I think some of that could be okay for us. We just, if we get, if we're doing more with less, that's a positive thing.


Colin

00:23:49.700 - 00:23:56.656

Well, and if you're looking for, you know, positivity, go no further than the lord of Dyneema garage grown gear.


Producer Dave

00:23:56.828 - 00:23:57.704

There you go.


Colin

00:23:57.792 - 00:24:38.906

Who is your hub for all things ultralight backpacking? And they've got an epic thru hiking giveaway running right now. They are over 15,000.


There are over $15,000 worth of prizes from dozens of the best ultralight backpacking brands like Hyperlite Mountain Gear, Gossamer Gear, Western mountaineering and Z Packs, just to name a few. They'll be choosing 10 winners, so go ahead and enter now before the giveaway closes on March 26th.


Head to garagegrowinggear.com and click on the links there you'll find all the stuff you need to. All the things you need to. To enter that by going over there. Yeah. But, yeah, a bit of a serious episode today, folks.


So thank you, Lloyd and the crew at Garage Room Gear for giving us a little, a little bright spot as our partner in this so thank you. Thank you, guys.


Eoin Comerford

00:24:39.018 - 00:24:46.250

I assume we can't win, right, because we're kind of part of the gig because that's 15k in gear. That's kind of sweet.


Colin

00:24:46.410 - 00:25:31.808

I already entered like 16 times. Is that all right? Let me know. Garage drone gear. I'll give it to somebody else. I'll share, I'll share it with these guys.


All right, so next up, we've got a few quick hitting brand and product stories to run through.


And this part of the show is presented by Oboz, who loves hiking, wants us to talk more about hiking, you know, the activity that we all do but no one talks about. So we're going to count the ways we love hiking in a minute. But first up this week, Yeti recently released.


Well, Yeti recently released a new backpack, the Ranchero 27. Literally, that's eerily similar to the Mystery Ranch Catalyst 26. And this week, Gear Junkie did a breakdown of the pack.


Oh, and you posted about it on LinkedIn, which I went looking at that this morning. You got a lot of commentary about this pack review. I was kind of surprised actually.


Eoin Comerford

00:25:31.864 - 00:26:06.406

It got a lot, a lot of, a lot of love. Yeah, it was interesting. The comments were all over the place. Quite a.


Quite a lot of people were like, yeah, that's, that is Yeti's brand equity and that's how Yeti prices stuff. And by golly, it makes total sense. And then there were other people that were more like, well, the Mystery Ranch one, it looks like shit.


You know, the Yeti one looks really cool. And like there was one guy that was like, well, the Yeti one has those straps.


Those straps, I mean, you get in the backcountry, those straps are worth the $96 difference. Oh, oh, yeah.


Colin

00:26:06.438 - 00:26:11.654

So, okay, the 15 cent, you know, webbing is right. It's a nice, it's a hell of a margin on those straps.


Eoin Comerford

00:26:11.782 - 00:27:05.014

But so the reality is, and I think what I wish I had done actually is show that really the Yeti piece is somewhat of a combination of the. The two day assault, which is another 27 liter pack, also has a laptop pocket and is 229.


So it's kind of in between, but is actually a far superior pack to the, to the, to the Yeti piece. The Yeti piece is much more of kind of a lifestyle element. The Two Day Assault does have those straps that apparently are worth $96.


It also has, you know, pals webbing, but it has a full plastic backplate. It's got a much better, you Know, SC strap system. It's got a waist belt, removable, much, much better padding and wider back panel.


I mean, it's just a much better gear.


Colin

00:27:05.062 - 00:27:09.890

Nerd. You are such a gear dork. I didn't know you were this deep on this stuff, man.


Eoin Comerford

00:27:10.190 - 00:27:30.270

Well, yeah, hey, I, you know, I had to sell this stuff. You know, you can't just. Just fake it. I mean, you got to know what it is that the. You got to know your merchant. But I mean.


Yeah, so for them, for people saying that. Well, yeah, the Yeti one, because it's 700 during your Cordura versus 500. Junior. I mean, stop. Just stop. And.


Colin

00:27:30.970 - 00:28:05.854

But I did like friend of the pod, Kevin Joyce. He meant a good, good point about the potential margins being off versus Mystery Ranch versus Versus Yeti. I thought that was an interesting point.


But the. My question is, how do we think this plays into yeti's plans, the Sunset Mystery Ranch, later this year? I mean, I think it's a. I don't know.


Do we feel like they're. Do you think they might backtrack? Do you think there might be sort of a.


A way where they're going to kind of coexist and they're sort of testing the waters on that? Because this is like they kind of put a similar silhouette of two different backpacks out there and see how it goes. Or is this.


Is this priming the pump for. Oh, don't worry, Mystery Ranch is going away and this is what you're going to have going forward.


Eoin Comerford

00:28:06.022 - 00:28:17.626

Oh, yeah, no, this is priming the pump.


I mean, you don't make two products that look almost the same and then like, ah, you can get this one, or for 50% more, you can get this one that has the same product.


Colin

00:28:17.698 - 00:28:18.378

Why are they waiting?


Producer Dave

00:28:18.474 - 00:28:33.482

This is where we praise the benevolence of Yeti because in days of yore, they just would have ripped them off and not even said anything. But at least they bought the brand before that. They marginalized it and took their ip. I think there's a real kindness going on there.


Eoin Comerford

00:28:33.666 - 00:28:49.772

I think the answer to your question, though, Colin, is why I have them both running is just because Mystery Ranch already has a ton of inventory and they, you know, and a ton of on order from their retail partners. So it's not, it's not a spigot you just turn off overnight.


Colin

00:28:49.836 - 00:28:50.440

Right.


Eoin Comerford

00:28:51.140 - 00:29:03.900

But.


But clearly the yeti is going to completely replace it with a, you know, very similar product line, just a little bit more expensive that is in line with yeti's own, you know, margin expectations.


Colin

00:29:04.060 - 00:29:06.080

So $96 straps.


Eoin Comerford

00:29:06.830 - 00:29:08.650

They're really nice straps.


Colin

00:29:11.070 - 00:29:47.352

Also this past week, there were two stories of outdoor industry parent organizations in distress. First, it was reported that Solo brands acknowledged they may be at a point where their, quote, ability to continue is a concern.


And then one day later, Pelican International made moves towards a potential bankruptcy filing in Canada. To clarify, Pelican International is the owner of water sports brands such as Dagger Wilderness Systems and Perception Kayaks.


This is not the case brand Pelican that we're talking about. So let's start with Solo. They were the first ones out. They own Solo Stove, Chubby's and ORU Kayak. They are mostly a. Or entirely a DTC business.


Is it mostly or entirely? Are they all dtc?


Eoin Comerford

00:29:47.416 - 00:29:49.192

No, no, they're in wholesale. Yeah.


Colin

00:29:49.256 - 00:29:52.776

Okay, so some wholesale as well. They're known for their DTC business.


Eoin Comerford

00:29:52.848 - 00:30:15.564

Yeah. And they started in D2C. So like Chubby's for example, that's one of the brands under their umbrella.


Started as a D2C brand, but now is really big in wholesale. They have a huge presence in Dick's Sporting as an example.


And obviously Solo brands started as Solo Stove, which was totally D2C, but then got into wholesale.


Colin

00:30:15.612 - 00:30:29.788

That's right. Now they're like in Target and Places as well.


But even with that wholesale presence, I think you wrote in your post on LinkedIn about it that all their revenue coming in Is accounting for 96% of their operating expenses or something. Is that a piece?


Eoin Comerford

00:30:29.884 - 00:30:40.224

No. So basically, if you look at the financials, the. Their Gross margin is 61%, which is actually. That's solid.


Colin

00:30:40.272 - 00:30:40.432

Right.


Eoin Comerford

00:30:40.456 - 00:32:06.330

I mean, if you can have a 60%, 1% gross margin, which usually includes the product margin plus like shipping and handling costs and those sorts of things, that's the basis of actually kind of a decent P and L. Right. And even their marketing expense is not insane. It's about like 20, 21% of. Of sales. Okay.


Which, you know, even for the companies that I work, the smaller companies, like, you know, 20% is like the very upper end. I'd much rather see it closer to 15%, but it's not. You could potentially get there right to profitability. So, okay, so we've got 61% take away 21%.


We've got 40% left to cover all of our other expenses. Usually you'd say, hey, that's great. 40, 40, 40%. We should be able to make that work.


Especially, you know, when we're a, you know, 400 plus million dollar company. You know, 40% of that is like, you know, 240 million. You're like, okay, that works. Unfortunately, their actual operating expenses are 96% of revenue.


Not 40% is 435 million, which is like, woof. You know, and so it's really like, where. How do you manage to spend that?


Now, in fairness, a chunk of that, of the 135, 136 of that is actually restructuring. Restructuring, contract termination and impairment charges.


Colin

00:32:06.990 - 00:32:09.654

Part of it was they're blowing through CEOs over there.


Producer Dave

00:32:09.742 - 00:32:13.974

Well, look, they've got a hearty lead budget for their. Their influencers.


Colin

00:32:14.022 - 00:32:15.910

I'll get into Snoop Dogg. Don't worry.


Eoin Comerford

00:32:16.070 - 00:32:17.622

So he had to come up.


Producer Dave

00:32:17.646 - 00:32:19.450

That's all cash. It's out the door.


Eoin Comerford

00:32:20.750 - 00:32:41.566

But. But they. But part of that is also the fact that I think they shut down one of their acquisitions, Icy Breeze. And so there's a major hit from that.


But. Yeah, but even taking all that aside, you still have a huge.


I don't understand how you spend that money, quite frankly, because you take that piece out of it.


Colin

00:32:41.638 - 00:32:46.542

You have to try to. Right? I mean, how do you. You have to be like, what are you writing checks for? Right.


Eoin Comerford

00:32:46.566 - 00:33:32.824

So they're sga, right? So not marketing, not product. None of that. Just SG and a $180 million. Okay. And I think part of that is just kind of a broken DTC model.


And we've seen this story before, right? The whole DTC darling thing, which they were. They were like the outdoor D2C darling.


But, you know, we've seen it with Allbirds, with Peloton, with, you know, Casper Outdoor voices, yada, on and on, right? All of these brands that were just really ascendant in the late teens and now rough. They really thought of themselves as a D2C brand.


In fact, when they went public in 2021, they chose the stock symbol D2C. Right?


Colin

00:33:32.912 - 00:33:34.856

Hubris will come back and bite you every time.


Eoin Comerford

00:33:34.928 - 00:33:41.352

That's amazing, because what they thought was, we have cracked the code on D2C.


Colin

00:33:41.376 - 00:33:42.008

Yeah, we got it.


Eoin Comerford

00:33:42.064 - 00:34:28.798

We have got this. This solo stove thing. Killing it.


And so we're going to just buy up a bunch of these outdoor active D2C brands, sprinkle our D2C magic on them, and we're just going to be rolling in the cash. So we're going to buy. They bought our Oru Kayak. They bought Aisle, which is like another kayak brand.


They bought Chubby's Icy Breeze, you know, and it's. And it's Been. It's been not good. So the stock peaked shortly after the IPO at $21. Yesterday it was 22 cents. Yeah.


To the math math geniuses on amongst our listeners, that is a drop of 99%.


Colin

00:34:28.974 - 00:34:37.770

Who's going to be representing them at the bankruptcy hearings with a B. Snoop Dogg or you know, wearing chubbies. Right. Well, they just to gain favor with the judge, you know.


Producer Dave

00:34:38.390 - 00:35:28.940

So let me ask a question to that though.


In the sense like you've got their holdings and Chubby's does seem to be doing well at least from a visibility and product and you know, do we know that that brought that that brand is necessarily unprofitable? Could that be sold off like a bright spot? Yeah, instantly, like because you know, I look at the other brand like kayaking.


We know this category is in trouble and it has been for a while. And Solo Stove is, is a backyard stove. Like I, you know, I cannot ascribe that to any kind of long term, you know, massive growth potential.


It's a backyard stove. But Chubby's is solidly the lifestyle apparel category that has a pretty good handle on who they're consumer is in their community.


So I just, I feel like that that's a potential valuable, valuable property.


Eoin Comerford

00:35:29.600 - 00:37:36.690

I would, I would say that the most likely scenario here is that they to stay out of bankruptcy. They basically sell off the Chubby's brand. They bought it at a real premium a couple of years ago. So they'll probably take a big hit for that.


But from a cash perspective I think they could still get a pretty decent number for Chubby's. And you know it's high margin.


They actually pretty efficient from a marketing perspective and as I said really taking off in wholesale right now and in a lot of bigger players. It's premium price but not crazy premium, very accessible, cool, fun.


So yes, I do think that Chubby's is probably the most valuable piece of the puzzle. And the other thing that they did was they actually drew down their line of credit.


So I think they had what's called a cleanup provision where you have to get your, their credit credit line down to zero. So they kind of cleaned it up towards the end of the year but then they maxed it in January.


So they took out like 277 million on the credit line because base and then they basically said oh by the way, you know we're, we're in all of it. We're good under our covenants right now.


So just a little background when you get a line of credit or a loan, you have these agreements with banks to say, hey, listen, we got to do certain things and hit certain financial thresholds. Otherwise you can call the loan. Right. So that's a covenant.


So what, what they're now saying is we're not going to be able to keep our covenants going into next year.


So we basically, we took all the money we could to basically, you know, sort of stockpile it for a, you know, for, for, for the, the tough times ahead. Yeah. So, yeah. And the thing of it is, I mean, it's, they are good brands. They're great products. You know, there's a lot here, here.


It' whether they are going to have the Runway to be able to right the ship outside of a bankruptcy process.


Colin

00:37:37.870 - 00:38:00.790

Well, Dave, you mentioned the struggles of the kayaking category. Pelican, the next one we were talking about, they're a little bit of a different situation than what was going on solo.


The struggles seem to be more related to those struggles in the kayaking category and also the uncertainty presented by. Here it comes again. The Trump administration's tariff will we or won't we situation. This just came out last night as we were prepping this episode.


What did you learn about what's going on in Pelican there, Owen?


Eoin Comerford

00:38:01.290 - 00:40:17.460

So with Pelican and actually, I heard about this, I think before it really broke in the news through somebody on LinkedIn. But yeah, so they're based in Quebec, and so they have filed a notice of intent to make a proposal under the Canadian Bankruptcy and Insolvency Act.


And, and I'm not an expert in the Canadian bankruptcy law, but from what I gather, this is kind of like a chapter 11 versus a chapter 7. So in other words, it's a restructuring versus a liquidation.


So they're really going to look to renegotiate their debt, what they owe their vendors, et cetera.


Also worth noting that Confluence Outdoor, which includes Dagger Kayaks, Perception Wilderness Systems, GSI Advanced Elements, like a bunch of brands, the US Subsidiary that they're part of is not included right now. But they're not saying it won't be included or that they won't do something separately there.


But yeah, it's obviously, it's a really tough time in the kayak space right now and a lot of deals happening here and there.


And the kayak industry is still one of the ones that even going into this year probably was still going to be rough because, you know, I think I've talked about this before, but, but really the, the length of, of the hangover is directly proportional to the cost of the product. So you know kayaks where if somebody in 21 went out and bought a fifteen hundred dollar or two thousand dollars kayak.


Kayak, they're not going to be in the market for another kayak for quite a while. Same thing with $2,000 bikes. So that's why those two categories are in such rough shape.


Even today and even going into this year when we were thinking things were going to be good, it still wasn't going to be good in those categories.


So, yeah, it's tough and hopefully this will give them the air cover to be able to reorganize and keep these important brands in good space, in a good place and supporting the industry.


Colin

00:40:20.160 - 00:40:34.280

Today's episode of the Rock Bite is presented by Oboz, who is helping us ask the question, how do I love hiking? Let me count the ways. Number one, the unholy power of duct tape on blisters. You don't question it, you just trust it.


Producer Dave

00:40:34.320 - 00:40:38.220

You know, Colin, if you're wearing Oboz, you don't need to worry about blisters.


Colin

00:40:38.970 - 00:40:40.178

Can you prove that in a court of law?


Producer Dave

00:40:40.234 - 00:40:40.990

I can.


Colin

00:40:41.370 - 00:40:42.310

Okay.


Producer Dave

00:40:43.290 - 00:40:47.190

Yes. It's podiatric jurisprudence.


Colin

00:40:47.770 - 00:40:55.378

Number two, feeling like a hobbit on a grand quest, even if the quest is just a loop trail. And number three, mid hike.


Eoin Comerford

00:40:55.474 - 00:41:00.750

Hobbits, though, don't wear anything on their feet. We're doing this for a boot brand.


Colin

00:41:01.610 - 00:41:04.114

They wear oboes. I think I was in. That was in Tolkien's.


Producer Dave

00:41:04.242 - 00:41:06.382

Yeah, you're clearly not shooting the.


Colin

00:41:06.426 - 00:41:06.630

The.


Producer Dave

00:41:06.670 - 00:41:09.574

The Oboe's Clan of the Shire in.


Colin

00:41:09.582 - 00:41:11.250

The appendices, I think. Or the.


Producer Dave

00:41:12.110 - 00:41:16.534

Yeah, in Frodo's birthday party. They were off to the left, the Oboe's clan. And they were the ones.


Colin

00:41:16.582 - 00:41:17.878

There was, there was the Proud Foot.


Producer Dave

00:41:17.934 - 00:41:18.850

Yeah, that's right.


Colin

00:41:19.150 - 00:41:20.854

And then the oboe is. What?


Eoin Comerford

00:41:20.862 - 00:41:23.222

It was the oboe.


Producer Dave

00:41:23.286 - 00:41:24.278

Okay, absolutely.


Eoin Comerford

00:41:24.374 - 00:41:26.006

Just, just checking. I just want to make sure.


Producer Dave

00:41:26.078 - 00:41:26.374

Yeah.


Colin

00:41:26.422 - 00:41:30.070

No, they didn't. They weren't. They weren't. They didn't destroy the one ring or anything, but they, they were there.


Producer Dave

00:41:30.110 - 00:41:32.650

No, they were hiking. I mean, they had. They were busy.


Colin

00:41:33.940 - 00:41:40.588

And number three on the list today, mid hike, daydreams of the post hike feast. Are we talking burgers? Tacos? Maybe both.


Producer Dave

00:41:40.644 - 00:41:41.564

Yeah, I've been. I've.


Colin

00:41:41.612 - 00:41:43.560

Maybe some pizza too. Why not?


Eoin Comerford

00:41:43.940 - 00:41:47.520

Sure. I love a good burger taco.


Producer Dave

00:41:48.180 - 00:41:48.540

Right.


Colin

00:41:48.580 - 00:41:56.188

Burger taco. Yeah, I'm into that. I like how you said that too. Very, very St. Patrick of you. Right there. The. I don't know. How did you say that's how you.


Producer Dave

00:41:56.244 - 00:41:58.206

Keep the the warm Guinness down is.


Eoin Comerford

00:41:58.268 - 00:42:05.754

A every once in a while the, the, the Gaelic in this just creeps out tacos.


Colin

00:42:05.802 - 00:42:09.830

It's like you know the barrier between that is at its thinnest on St. Patrick's Day.


Eoin Comerford

00:42:10.530 - 00:42:13.710

Well, for many reasons, yes.


Colin

00:42:15.090 - 00:43:08.530

Number four, hiking means finding your soulmates. And in this case that means Roads, Rivers and Trails of Milford, Ohio.


If you find yourself in the greater Milford area, pop in and say hi to the folks at Roads, Rivers and Trails. And maybe like the obscure hobbits of the shire, buy a pair of Oboz boots.


And number five means the Oboes Katabatic collection which has added all new the all new Katabatic LT which takes the whole collection to a new level. With a lighter package, improved performance and additional environmentally friendly materials. They go fast packing day hiking, whatever your fancy.


The Catabatic LT is your hiking shoe of choice. And this hiking appreciation moment is brought to you by oboz, a Bozeman, Montana certified B Corp.


6 million tree planter and proud inhabitant of the Greater Yellowstone ecosystem. Oboz is the maker of premium quality footwear for the trail and the cupid to the outdoor world. Oboz love hiking.


Chris DeMakes

00:43:09.430 - 00:43:11.890

It's time for a party shot.


Eoin Comerford

00:43:13.270 - 00:43:13.694

All right.


Colin

00:43:13.702 - 00:44:41.522

For my parting shot. I'm excited, excited to talk to you guys about this today. So last week outdoor brand Stio announced its first ever technical footwear line.


The Ridge Cap Collection is available to buy on Steo's website and in their locations throughout the U.S. the products are basically a low and a mid mid lightweight hiking boot.


Though interestingly the word boot is not used in the press release announcing the launch. Just shoe. But they basically, they're basically unremarkable shoes. I think looking at them I have some nits to pick on the design but.


But that's not why I'm bringing them up as the parting shot. Normally I would land base this move because breaking into footwear as I've talked about before is really challenging.


But this is from Steo, who seems to have the habit of just sort of chugging along, kind of untouched by whatever else is happening in the industry. So I suppose my parting shot is that I'm predicting that these new shoes or boots or whatever they're calling them from Steo won't catch on.


I mean it's a lot of inventory and investment to make and distribute them only via D2C which is what they're currently doing. So. So I think the smart money would say that's not going to happen, but because it's Steo. I don't feel good about that prediction.


I mean analyzing Steel was sort of like Nielsen trying to figure out who's watching what on Netflix. So I don't know. But I'm curious what you guys think. I mean, how do we. Steel just sort of. They just do their thing.


They just keep showing up like you know, opening new stores, new product collections. People love them. They're in. They. They do. They sell to wholesale.


They're around but they kind of little like arteryx have removed themselves from the conversation. So. So I don't know. What do you guys think of these. These shoes? Not boots.


Eoin Comerford

00:44:41.586 - 00:45:00.022

I mean, I mean from a look perspective, they do have that sort of interesting like sneaker meets hiking boot kind of thing. Like I think was it who. Who did that first? Well, all of them for. Well, no, there was like Forsake, I think was. Was. Was one of the.


Producer Dave

00:45:00.036 - 00:45:05.202

Forsake was one of them. Danner also played in that fairly early in terms of this.


Colin

00:45:05.386 - 00:45:14.816

I mean they're still. They're kind of on the, you know, the. The keen oboe's Merrell corner though, right. Of that kind of in between. Soft hiking shoe.


Eoin Comerford

00:45:14.928 - 00:45:26.768

Here's what I would say is I think Steel knows its customer. Okay. And its customer is a mid-50s white guy. That is. That is. That is. That is the CEO customer.


Colin

00:45:26.864 - 00:45:29.312

And this is as represented today by.


Eoin Comerford

00:45:29.416 - 00:46:02.006

By everyone on this phone call. But no, you. You guys aren't. Aren't as old as I am. But anyway, I mean this. This sort of. It. It feels like elevated dad shoe to me as I look at it.


And you know what? Maybe. Maybe that's what that customer wants, right? Like if they had gone like a. So like okay, Colin, if they come out with a Steo super shoe.


Okay, 300. No, but I mean that would have been like what I think a lot of companies.


Colin

00:46:02.078 - 00:46:03.046

Yeah. What do you do?


Eoin Comerford

00:46:03.198 - 00:46:15.030

We want to have this super shoe. And that would have been completely wrong for this customer in this demographic. So it's like Skechers by Steel. I mean it's.


Colin

00:46:15.370 - 00:46:43.380

Oh yes, that's. You just nailed it. It's really what it is. It is Skechers by Steel, But I think 160 bucks, not cheap. And I think the.


Well, I had kind of similar thoughts when Rabbit came out with their shoe last year. When Rabbit running. They came out with a shoe like one style. I don't know. Maybe they have one or two colors. Mostly just one color.


Shoes are just tough and they're expensive and you have. And the inventory all The. It's just a really hard category and I would just say this is a bad idea. Like why.


Eoin Comerford

00:46:43.420 - 00:46:43.636

Don't.


Colin

00:46:43.668 - 00:46:53.604

Don't bother. Why this is a hard, you know, road to hoe. Road to hoe. So why are we doing this? But to your point, Steo, they kind of know what they're.


It seems like they know what they're doing, let's say.


Eoin Comerford

00:46:53.612 - 00:47:28.528

I say, I think, I think it's probably great for that, that target audience. It's not cheap, but it's not insane. Right. You're kind of in there with the Hokas and the ons and the others. You've got a Vibram soul.


And so there's some technical aspects to this. Hey, you know. But I would agree with you about one thing though. It is super hard for an apparel brand to launch into footwear.


We've seen so many try and fail. I mean even arc'teryx, right, who I think is getting some kudos right now for their footwear collection.


Their first attempt at footwear did not go well.


Colin

00:47:28.584 - 00:47:36.596

Terrible. Yes, terrible. Like, I mean, like, like it was a, like you should just scrapped it. You should not have brought it to market.


I don't care what you spent on that behind the scenes. It was that bad.


Eoin Comerford

00:47:36.668 - 00:47:43.252

Yeah. And for a brand that had Solomon as a stablemate to help them basically.


Producer Dave

00:47:43.316 - 00:47:47.412

Design it, that was the most inexplicable part of the whole thing.


Colin

00:47:47.596 - 00:47:49.520

That was the biggest miss of all time.


Eoin Comerford

00:47:51.020 - 00:48:05.696

But you know, Steo is not trying to reinvent the world here with like Arcteryx was with the booty and the whole bit. Right. This so bad. This is. I don't know. Yeah, it's a dad shoe.


Producer Dave

00:48:05.888 - 00:49:20.880

Elevated dad shoe is a great description of this and it does feel like I said, I also put faith in, I think they know their customer. They're going to have some. It's their expectations if they see this as a growth.


I don't know about that necessarily, but with like one of those challenges of building a footwear line out of an apparel especially mindset is the design language. There's just no new design language and it's really hard to get to a new design language.


So you need disruptors or performance brands that can use that form follows function as kind of a, as a reason to create some silhouettes and stuff that kind of defy convention. Right. Getting to that. And here these are clearly not built for that. These are just to be comfortable. They're. They're just like brown shoes.


I, I called them like steel. Kai's you know what I mean? Or, you know, just kind of. They're just kind of that lifestyle kind of brown shoe, like a performance loafer.


Totally makes sense with this crowd like that. That's what you should be seeing for sure. But, yeah, I think it's the Hocus Speed. Yeah, it just. It is. It's just. It's a product line. It is. It's a ste.


Yeah, that's nice. It's not another one. That kind of mitt, though, I think it will cut, tie back together. That's kind of like a steel Bose.


I think maybe that's kind of where we're going.


Colin

00:49:21.340 - 00:50:19.078

I think this. This is a little like people who are betting on the Chiefs before the Super Bowl.


Like, everyone's like, well, the Eagles have a better team, but, God, you can't. I can't bet against, you know, Patrick Mahomes and the Chiefs. Right. And then. And this is how I feel here.


It's like everything is lined up to say, you probably shouldn't have done this deal. But I kind of don't want to bet against them based off of, like, in the past. I'm like, what the hell are they doing?


They're not going to make it then. Look, they just kind of keep figuring it out. But, I mean, it is lined up again. You got two styles. You're in your own stores.


Like we said, expensive to produce, inventory, all those things. It is stacked against those. So it's kind of a weak parting shot that I'm like, I don't think it's gonna work. But I'm really.


If you made me put my money on it, I'd probably put it on them. So I don't know. We'll see how this one shakes out. Maybe. Maybe.


Maybe a year from now, all of a sudden, they have their next two styles that they're just gonna fill out their line. I have no idea. I will. I will throw a rock at the. I do not like the sidewall pinecone.


Producer Dave

00:50:19.174 - 00:50:19.850

Yeah.


Colin

00:50:20.670 - 00:50:21.788

I think that looks that.


Eoin Comerford

00:50:21.844 - 00:50:22.572

It looks like it's.


Colin

00:50:22.636 - 00:50:31.068

I didn't know what it was at first. I'm like, why are we putting a weird boulder? Why does it look like the thing from the Fantastic Four on the side of your shoe?


You're like, oh, that's. That's your pinecone logo I see now.


Eoin Comerford

00:50:31.204 - 00:50:31.644

Exactly.


Colin

00:50:31.692 - 00:50:32.764

Not a good design aesthetic.


Eoin Comerford

00:50:32.812 - 00:50:33.440

Yeah.


Colin

00:50:34.180 - 00:50:36.892

But to your point, better than other brands have done in their first attempt.


Producer Dave

00:50:36.956 - 00:50:40.720

It's like Geranimals, though. It's how you match them together. Make sure you've got the right pair.


Colin

00:50:41.220 - 00:50:42.240

Animals.


Eoin Comerford

00:50:43.140 - 00:50:43.756

Wow.


Colin

00:50:43.868 - 00:50:46.700

Okay. Another dated reference here on the rock.


Producer Dave

00:50:46.780 - 00:50:48.680

Yeah, well, you said dad shoes. Come on.


Colin

00:50:49.100 - 00:50:58.244

That's true. Good point. The dad Shoe podcast featuring us. That's all I got today, guys. Anything else, you guys, Anything else you guys have for the show today?


Eoin Comerford

00:50:58.412 - 00:51:01.412

No, no, that's. There's just way too much going on right now.


Producer Dave

00:51:01.516 - 00:51:33.940

Don't let the doom and gloom get you. We have a vital industry. Go outside and experience it. And you want to, you know, you want to do something.


Get our brands to pool their resources and fund outdoor jobs, outdoor events. Get outside. You know, they can't tear us down. They can't tear the parks down. Let's get out there.


And that's where the industry could play a part, because people working in the outdoor is the first step of a vital outdoor industry. So we've got to find a way to make sure that we keep people out there working.


Colin

00:51:34.060 - 00:51:37.540

It's my parting shot, producer Dave, with bringing the optimism.


Producer Dave

00:51:37.620 - 00:51:38.388

There you go.


Colin

00:51:38.524 - 00:51:41.800

Oh, and do you want to tell them again how we're all fucked like you said at the beginning of the episode?


Eoin Comerford

00:51:43.430 - 00:51:54.126

No, no, it's. He. No, that's the. That's the right approach, and I think that's the perfect approach for brands. Get your employees outside.


For retailers, get your customers outside.


Producer Dave

00:51:54.198 - 00:51:54.542

That's right.


Eoin Comerford

00:51:54.566 - 00:52:01.570

You know, let's come together. Let's have some. Some community here and build community outdoors.


Colin

00:52:01.990 - 00:52:36.080

We'll wrap it up there. Great job, guys. Come back on Wednesday to hear Shantae Salibar and I run through outdoor adventure headlines.


Check out the latest from the Rock Flight podcast network. Open container. New episode of that goes up tomorrow. The Rock Flight's a production of Rock Flight llc. Our producer today.


Producer David Karstad with art direction provided by Sarah. Where the hell is she anyway? Gensert. And for Owen Comerford, I'm Colin Truth. Thanks for listening.


And our guy Kristen makes he's back one more time like he always does, every single time to sing us right into another week. Get out. Oh, I scratched last week's script. I forgot I wrote that. We'll see you next time, Rock Fighters.


Producer Dave

00:52:37.780 - 00:52:39.000

It'll get out.


Chris DeMakes

00:52:47.060 - 00:53:39.560

Welcome to the Rock Fight where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows and sometimes agree to disagree.


We talk about human powered outdoor activities and big fights about topics that we find interesting like pop culture, music, the latest movie reviews, ideas that aim for the head. This is where we speak our truth. This is where we speak our truth. Rock Fight. Rock fight. Rock fight.


Welcome to the Rock Fight Rock fight, rock fight welcome to the rock Flight, fright, flight Rock fight, Rock light Rock fight, rock fight welcome to the rock Fight, rock fight Rap fight, rock fight.

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